71–80 of 82 posts
This isn't to excuse inappropriate behavior, but I do think that we should clearly label bots whenever possible to avoid embarrassments similar to this where one party knows it's a bot and the other doesn't.
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I've managed to couple without harrasing people doing their job over the internet (bot or not) so obviously it can be done.
I wouldn't consider asking someone out to be harassment all by itself. Do you?
I'd simply never want to make somebody feel uncomfortable because I choose a time that is not appropriate for such interactions. And for me, that pretty much means that unless we are sharing personal time together outside of such a relationship, then I don't engage in such activities.
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That’s nice, but what does it have to do with the discussion?
Because your argument, if you are aware that you made it, is that it is “economically repugnant”. That is what you said, and that was your previous argument. You are now arguing with your own argument, saying “No. Why would I have any feelings towards what other people do? That doesn't make any sense.” That is what it has to do with the discussion, that you are inconsistent and refuse to elaborate on your previous po…
This isn't to excuse inappropriate behavior, but I do think that we should clearly label bots whenever possible to avoid embarrassments similar to this where one party knows it's a bot and the other doesn't.
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Actually, even the polite men are being creepy. Hitting on someone you barely know, in a business environment, is just creepy cringe. Yeah, sure, you're being a "gentleman" by backing down when she inevitably rejects such an inappropriate advance, but after the hundredth insta-suitor, it gets old and even stressful and anxiety inducing.
I totally understand, but I don't really know the answer. Men who are more aggressive (in an appropriate or inappropriate manner) tend to be more successful. So, as a man, your options are to: 1. Ask fewer women out so that you are more respectful. This likely means you'll have less success dating. 2. Ask more women out, even in environments that might be uncomfortable, e.g. a server, co-worker, etc. They're going to…
Get to know someone before asking them out. Find out what they're like. Know what you're like, and what kinds of people you're compatible with. Your 20s and in some cases even 30s are your opportunity to learn.
Just blindly asking someone out is lazy and rude.
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That’s nice, but what does it have to do with the discussion?
Because your argument, if you are aware that you made it, is that it is “economically repugnant”. That is what you said, and that was your previous argument. You are now arguing with your own argument, saying “No. Why would I have any feelings towards what other people do? That doesn't make any sense.” That is what it has to do with the discussion, that you are inconsistent and refuse to elaborate on your previous po…
Somehow that turned into my objection, which was illogical. It didn't make sense then and it makes even less sense that it keeps coming up. It has no relevance to the thread... or life in general.
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I wouldn't consider asking someone out to be harassment all by itself. Do you?
It depends on context really. Which as someone on the spectrum (childhood diagnosis, not adult) has always presented its challenges and its why I personally have erred on the side of caution. I would not personally approach a woman for instance in an instance in which she is engaged in her employment activities and im interacting as a customer/vendor/partner whatever. However it's not unfeasible that it is my feeling…
Social norms like this can and do change over time, and it's my opinion that this (specifically, that asking people out in a work environment is always or nearly always inappropriate) is one that should -- because I think there's an alternative set of norms that leaves essentially everyone better off. Specifically I think that if it was understood by everyone that a person asking another person out (in any context, including at work) is responsible for dealing with rejection like an adult and not continuing to pester the person, then (absent any power difference that might imply a quid pro quo situation), there would be no reason to forbid it. Most people would still hesitate to do it (asking someone out can result in rejection, rejection is embarrassing), but the kind of scenario described by Martinussen in https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=akoboldfrying#389248..., where an employee fears for their job if they don't pander to an entitled customer, won't occur.
Interested in your thoughts.
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Because your argument, if you are aware that you made it, is that it is “economically repugnant”. That is what you said, and that was your previous argument. You are now arguing with your own argument, saying “No. Why would I have any feelings towards what other people do? That doesn't make any sense.” That is what it has to do with the discussion, that you are inconsistent and refuse to elaborate on your previous po…
The original comment questioned why the person in the article would be concerned about an employee receiving an email containing a request for a date. The answer is that they would have concerns because the worker is on the clock and it is costing them money to have their employee spend time dealing with the request (even if ultimately ignored). Somehow that turned into my objection, which was illogical. It didn't ma…
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It depends on context really. Which as someone on the spectrum (childhood diagnosis, not adult) has always presented its challenges and its why I personally have erred on the side of caution. I would not personally approach a woman for instance in an instance in which she is engaged in her employment activities and im interacting as a customer/vendor/partner whatever. However it's not unfeasible that it is my feeling…
Thanks for responding. I can certainly relate to feeling pressure not to upset other people, and even think that it's a healthy impulse to have, up to a point. (Certainly it's unhealthy to never feel it.) I don't think your feelings are abnormal -- to me they seem very much in agreement with current norms, in the US at least. But I would like you to think about whether the current socially decided notion of "what's a…
I never do well with these really I think because I often have both extreme, yet very conflicting positions on almost everything. But sure.
> I think that if it was understood by everyone that a person asking another person out (in any context, including at work) is responsible for dealing with rejection like an adult and not continuing to pester the person, then (absent any power difference that might imply a quid pro quo situation), there would be no reason to forbid it.
I would say in an ideal world, realistically, yes. Despite the suggestion my post my have originally given. It was probably too flippant, for which I apologise honestly.
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Thanks for responding. I can certainly relate to feeling pressure not to upset other people, and even think that it's a healthy impulse to have, up to a point. (Certainly it's unhealthy to never feel it.) I don't think your feelings are abnormal -- to me they seem very much in agreement with current norms, in the US at least. But I would like you to think about whether the current socially decided notion of "what's a…
> But I would like you to think about whether the current socially decided notion of "what's appropriate" is as balanced and as good for everyone as it could be. I never do well with these really I think because I often have both extreme, yet very conflicting positions on almost everything. But sure. > I think that if it was understood by everyone that a person asking another person out (in any context, including at…
The next time I'm in an internet argument that seems to be escalating, I hope I will remember these last couple of comments of yours, and be as willing to reconsider my own position as you have been.