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Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

theguardian.com

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Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#71

Post by surgical_fire »

longdudefromnl wrote: post #38
misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

Quote: Again this regulation comes from the EU so NL can't just change it This is -I think- (one of) the main reasons people voted PVV. We (the Dutch people) can't even make their own decisions! And when things fall apart (and they are: housing, inflation, too much environmentalism, declining healthcare, etc) this is exactly what we need: make decisions to fix this. But we 'can't' because of EU. This is extremely ang…

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Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#72

Post by underseacables »

blululu wrote: post #33
underseacables wrote: post #3

When you look at the electorate of the PVV in general, it consists of people who experience more difficulties to get by. They are more lonely... Sounds rather condescending. I don't like it when armchair experts place such subjective labels on people. "Lonely, less intelligent," etc. It's second guessing a persons vote which is a tacit way of undermining that vote. Rather they should analyze policy and try to underst…

In general the trope of a smug liberal is a thing, but I think you made the jump to intelligence: >>Matthijs Rooduijn, associate professor of political science at Amsterdam University, says such views are common among Wilders voters. “When you look at the electorate of the PVV in general, it consists of people who experience more difficulties to get by. They are more lonely. They feel that they are being neglected. T…

There was a post yesterday, or maybe the day before, here on HN about a BBC study that talked about intelligence related to a vote for Brexit. They claimed that people of low intelligence voted for Brexit.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38413594

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#73

Post by underseacables »

rutierut wrote: post #11
underseacables wrote: post #3

When you look at the electorate of the PVV in general, it consists of people who experience more difficulties to get by. They are more lonely... Sounds rather condescending. I don't like it when armchair experts place such subjective labels on people. "Lonely, less intelligent," etc. It's second guessing a persons vote which is a tacit way of undermining that vote. Rather they should analyze policy and try to underst…

I appreciate the sentiment but the idea that people support policy that’s good for them isn’t much better either. For an obvious example check how many people support the Affordable Care Act vs Obamacare.

affordable care act vs Obamacare

Those are the same thing…

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#74

Post by stef25 »

Kognito wrote: post #37
YiraldyGuber wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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With all due respect (and I'm definitely more on the Israeli side of this latest conflict) - those Arabs and Africans coming in don't get their own state in Europe in any way, shape or form.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#75

Post by xnx »

underseacables wrote: post #73
rutierut wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate the sentiment but the idea that people support policy that’s good for them isn’t much better either. For an obvious example check how many people support the Affordable Care Act vs Obamacare.

affordable care act vs Obamacare Those are the same thing…

That's the point. People liked the policy, but we're biased about anything with the word "Obama".

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#76

Post by YiraldyGuber »

ChatGTP wrote: post #25
misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

PVV proposes to stop all immigration Is there a documented case in history where this has been beneficial ? Not attacking you btw, I'm actually wondering if anyone has known this to be effective? Immigrants seem like a token thing to get angry about when the chips are down and the country is mismanaged.

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Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#77

Post by AnimalMuppet »

lynx23 wrote: post #48
underseacables wrote: post #3

When you look at the electorate of the PVV in general, it consists of people who experience more difficulties to get by. They are more lonely... Sounds rather condescending. I don't like it when armchair experts place such subjective labels on people. "Lonely, less intelligent," etc. It's second guessing a persons vote which is a tacit way of undermining that vote. Rather they should analyze policy and try to underst…

Stupidity is the new elitist insult. It started to be really noticeable with COVID-19. People with different opinions were simply labeled as too stupid to understand the gravity of the situation. Same is happeneing with democracy. Voting for the other side? Must be dumb as fuck... People seem to have lost the ability to accept that there can be different opinions.

And, if not stupid, they must be doing it deliberately, so they're evil.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#78

Post by ghaff »

PaulHoule wrote: post #62
newyankee wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada is not at all a crowded country, yet it has housing crisis. At least Netherlands had the foresight to create dense, urban spaces with cycling infrastructure and half decent public transit. All they need to do now is replicate this. The thing about environmental concerns is that the nos should be balanced with human quality of life, and in that lens the Dutch way really works better than many other developed co…

British Colombia has the same problem as California in that it is a lot of land but most of it is uninhabitable.

Or, also like California, there are places where land is pretty inexpensive but they are less desirable for various reasons and there isn't a lot of local employment available. (Yes, a fair bit of land is mountainous but there's also a fair bit of habitable but undeveloped/lightly developed land.)

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#79

Post by PaulHoule »

misja111 wrote: post #16

Weird to read a post here from a foreign newspaper trying to describe what happened in my own country. But largely it's true, many people are unhappy with the amount of migration, the housing crisis, the rising cost of living and also what they feel is too much environmentalism. They feel that the parties that were in the government during the last 10 years did not take their concerns seriously or even made them wors…

I think Wilders is pretty well known in the anglosphere, or at least I've been following him for a very long time. (Long before I got a job related to political science where I can listen to the 538 podcast and claim it is work related.) On the other hand, I've been a fan of the Netherlands too.

Re: Tax, healthcare, immigration: why Dutch people voted for Geert Wilders

#80

Post by fzeroracer »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #66
fzeroracer wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would hope people would look at Brexit as a model of how well that line of thought works. Especially as we're seeing how ugly the downstream effects are years afterwards.

What are the British population's attitude towards this post-Brexit reality now? Has anyone reflected on it?

Generally speaking, bad. Polls indicate that favorability for Brexit is probably around 35% or lower. It's been getting worse because a lot of the current crisis's the UK faces are the direct result of Brexit. Because a lot of things they took for granted in regards to stuff like the food chain or energy negotiations is something that directly impacts an individual's day to day life.
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