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Cash Amnesia

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Re: Cash Amnesia

#71

Post by toast0 »

claytonjy wrote: post #54
inconceivable wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no, absolutely no debit cards for me. i protect my cash with multiple layers of protection. if i lose my wallet or my phone the person who ends up with these things will have no clue where most of my money is at. amex takes most if not all the risk in my financial life when it comes to day to day spending. one time i had my wallet stolen and the only thing they could muster was a failed gas station transaction. they…

Is your ATM card not also a debit card? Mine have always been both.

You can get ATM-only cards, but you have to ask for them, and keep asking... at my credit union, I had an ATM-only card for a while, but when it expired, they sent a debit card and I didn't think it was worth the effort and waste to request they make and send a new ATM-only card at that point.

Re: Cash Amnesia

#72

Post by KomoD »

MyNameIsRansom wrote: post #28

Lots of small businesses do "cash no tax". It's not forgotten when it's spent. I've fixed my car in cash (primarily to save on tax; and to not have it known by insurance). It's hard for one to "amnesia" $5000 in cash. It's a tool, just like a credit card.

Is that legal?

Re: Cash Amnesia

#73

Post by JohnFen »

hunter2_ wrote: post #18

> “Certain products are more guilt-inducing because they feel more like impulsive purchases, like a foam hand for the sports game,” Huang says. “Some are more rational purchases, such as books or stationery products for class.” Sure enough, they found that customers were more likely to pay in cash for harder-to-justify items like stuffed plush mascots and Christmas ornaments. Or perhaps the group of people buying har…

I carry and use cash by default for general privacy reasons, but also use a card sometimes. In looking at the two purchases, it seems that I'll use a card when the amount of the purchase is high enough that I am not likely to have the cash in my pocket and in urgent (I wanted to say "emergency", but not just actual emergencies) situations.

If it's a purchase of under $10 or so, I'm exceptionally unlikely to use a card -- and I suspect that most of my impulse/fun purchases (like a foam finger would be if that was my thing) would be in cash for that reason, not because I felt an guilt about them.

Re: Cash Amnesia

#74

Post by hammock »

KomoD wrote: post #72
MyNameIsRansom wrote: post #28

Lots of small businesses do "cash no tax". It's not forgotten when it's spent. I've fixed my car in cash (primarily to save on tax; and to not have it known by insurance). It's hard for one to "amnesia" $5000 in cash. It's a tool, just like a credit card.

Is that legal?

Yes, and recently legal/not penalized for all credit cards in the US to advertise cash price and automatically add a fee for credit card purchases that is lightly advertised at point of sale

Someone else can come behind me and cite the court case/credit card guidance

Re: Cash Amnesia

#75

Post by JohnFen »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #8

> But more detailed record-keeping may undermine financial apps’ usefulness. “If people know that there’s going to be a record every time they use Apple Pay, based on our theory, people actually will use it less compared to if Apple Pay doesn’t automatically track and record and remind them in the statement.” This is so weird to me since I want to know how much I spend in any category. I’m annoyed only one of my link…

> This is so weird to me since I want to know how much I spend in any category.

So do I -- I would just prefer that Apple (or insert any other company in their place) didn't have access to that information. I can keep track of my own spending, I don't need a company to do it for me.

Re: Cash Amnesia

#76

Post by mindslight »

TheRealPomax wrote: post #24
hunter2_ wrote: post #18

> “Certain products are more guilt-inducing because they feel more like impulsive purchases, like a foam hand for the sports game,” Huang says. “Some are more rational purchases, such as books or stationery products for class.” Sure enough, they found that customers were more likely to pay in cash for harder-to-justify items like stuffed plush mascots and Christmas ornaments. Or perhaps the group of people buying har…

When I first moved to North America, the idea that a credit card company was allowed to give people cash back, offer insurance, etc. for using their cards seemed like some bizarroworld "how is this legal" concept. Having lived here for decades, it still is. It's like an alcohol shop rewarding its most alcoholic customers by giving them free booze. And then if you sign up for a new card, or you cancel a card, some ran…

You haven't taken into account the US ideal of a bifurcated society, and are probably imagining some singular credit card user archtype who relies on the credit and also benefits from the rewards. I personally am able to set my credit cards to autopay in full every month, so CC rewards are just a straightforward discount [0]. And I'd guess anybody that talks about rewards as prudent financial advice is in a similar boat. Whereas for the disempowered person who can only pay part of their balance, rewards are just another cognitive hazard to avoid being swayed by, lest they get milked even harder.

As for the original topic, I personally hate seeing the echo of my spending in a monthly statement. It's like making the decision to buy everything twice, even for things that are straightforwardly necessary or prudent.

[0] with the tradeoff of the transaction going in more surveillance databases and being solidly connected to my government-issued nym, of course

Re: Cash Amnesia

#77

Post by gruez »

TheRealPomax wrote: post #69
croutonwagon wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I straight use credit cards as insurance, especially against scams. I specifically dont use a debit card at all and dont carry it. I only have it to pull money out and it stays locked in a safe at home. CC's allow me to ensure things like Amazon sellers arent scamming you, or worse, random websites with awful return policies. With a CC merchant that have a motivation to work on your behalf (ie: to get you to pay them…

Yes, with a debit card in North America that is certainly true. Because banks are shit here.

Not really, because most banks have zero liability policies even though the law doesn't mandate it[1]. That said, the susceptibility to fraud is a fundamental problem with debit cards. When the card gets charged, it's your money that's taken out (or at least put on hold). On a credit card, it's the bank's money. That's an important difference, because even if you get reimbursed for it at the end, you're still without money during the time it takes for your bank to reimburse you. With a credit card you have a few weeks from when the statement is issued to pay.

[1] https://usa.visa.com/pay-with-visa/visa-chip-technology-cons...

Re: Cash Amnesia

#78

Post by gruez »

TheRealPomax wrote: post #24
hunter2_ wrote: post #18

> “Certain products are more guilt-inducing because they feel more like impulsive purchases, like a foam hand for the sports game,” Huang says. “Some are more rational purchases, such as books or stationery products for class.” Sure enough, they found that customers were more likely to pay in cash for harder-to-justify items like stuffed plush mascots and Christmas ornaments. Or perhaps the group of people buying har…

When I first moved to North America, the idea that a credit card company was allowed to give people cash back, offer insurance, etc. for using their cards seemed like some bizarroworld "how is this legal" concept. Having lived here for decades, it still is. It's like an alcohol shop rewarding its most alcoholic customers by giving them free booze. And then if you sign up for a new card, or you cancel a card, some ran…

> When I first moved to North America, the idea that a credit card company was allowed to give people cash back, offer insurance, etc. for using their cards seemed like some bizarroworld "how is this legal" concept. Having lived here for decades, it still is. It's like an alcohol shop rewarding its most alcoholic customers by giving them free booze.

Should businesses not be allowed to offer perks to their customers in order to get an edge over their competitors? Your example involving an alcohol shop only seems weird because it involves an addictive substance. I doubt people would describe hotel or supermarket loyalty programs as some "bizarroworld "how is this legal" concept".

Re: Cash Amnesia

#79

Post by TheRealPomax »

gruez wrote: post #77
TheRealPomax wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, with a debit card in North America that is certainly true. Because banks are shit here.

Not really, because most banks have zero liability policies even though the law doesn't mandate it[1]. That said, the susceptibility to fraud is a fundamental problem with debit cards. When the card gets charged, it's your money that's taken out (or at least put on hold). On a credit card, it's the bank's money. That's an important difference, because even if you get reimbursed for it at the end, you're still without…

> most banks have zero liability policies even though the law doesn't mandate it

how is that "not really"? That's "yeah, because"

Re: Cash Amnesia

#80

Post by bern4444 »

I've always thought the opposite.

When I pay for something with cash I remember it far more strongly than when I pay with card. I pay with a card all the time and the action is the same no matter the price. I tap it and move on.

With cash I remember having to go get the cash, counting out the right amount at the register, and physically handing it over. And then I notice its absence since now I gave up all the cash I had and need to go to the ATM again. I see and feel the loss more strongly.

You actually lose something physical when you pay with cash unlike with a card. Especially if its a large purchase, I feel the cash loss harder and remember it longer - hard to forget handing over several bills ($50+) for those expensive transactions.

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