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Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

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Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#71

Post by drtse4 »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #21
_delirium wrote: post #2

Huh, I had thought the "brogrammer" thing was a parody, not a serious self-description. I usually run across variants of the descriptor "bro-ish" as derogatory, not something people actually want to call themselves; for example, "brostep" is a derogatory term for a subgenre of dubstep that dubstep purists don't like, not something people proudly call their own music. But I'm admittedly totally out of this particular…

Problem is , if this catches on with recruiters who will use it very non ironically like "rockstar". How long until we see "Brogrammer needed" ads

And would that be a problem? Not that we need a method to spot bad recruiters, but for those who still think that it makes sense to evaluate quality, what you describe could be a good method to identify the most degenerate ones.

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#72

Post by jessedhillon »

Tycho wrote: post #49
jessedhillon wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's common with all those behaviors he described is that the way they are usually carried, and the predictable "maleness" with which they are chosen, create an air of trying way too hard -- this is something I defintely experience when meeting many programmers. The irony is that the most defining characteristic of authentic masculinity, for most women I know, is the sense that a man believes in hemself and does wh…

So does that mean femininity does not entail belief in one's self and doing what feels right?

Only if you think femininity is the set of all things not masculine.

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#74

Post by Vergle »

cbo wrote: post #51

First, let's be clear that the term "brogrammer", tongue-in-cheek or not, is downright misogynistic. But equally problematic are the common beliefs that spawned the term in the first place; that programmers must always be obsessed with technology above all else, and to appreciate things like sports, fashion, or fast cars is somehow "bad" or "uncommon" for programmers. There are a whole host of programmers who despise…

At the first sentence I was like "..really?" then you were like "DHH ... enjoys fashion" and my head exploded. He dresses like a high school kid.

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#75

Post by swang »

sebphfx wrote: post #36
jiggy2011 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's sort of my point. The original nerdy stereotype is somebody with big teeth , a comb-over and a checked shirt tucked into corduroy pants, possibly also a neck beard. The next generation of nerds distanced themselves from this somewhat by wearing heavy metal T shirts, having long hair and tattoos. This became uncool too, so now we have the "brogrammer" with designer polo shirts and dark glasses. It's interesting…

I m gonna bring back punk into programming.It needs more of it.

We already have that: People who don't declare good variable names, people who don't follow DRY, creating spaghetti code. That's like the punk of programming.

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#77

Post by [deleted] »

lizzard wrote: post #26
DarkShikari wrote: post #4

From Urban Dictionary: brogrammer, n.: A programmer who breaks the usual expectations of quiet nerdiness and opts instead for the usual trappings of a frat-boy: popped collars, bad beer, and calling everybody "bro". Despised by everyone, especially other programmers. Ex: Oh my god, John is talking about football and chicks again. That guy is such a brogrammer. See also: programmer, frat boy, bro, douchebag, developer…

Hipster irony that sounds and behaves exactly like actual misogyny, as far as I'm concerned, is actual misogyny. A lot of bigotry and exclusionary behavior is couched in terms of being "just a joke".

[deleted]

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#78

Post by Vergle »

jfoutz wrote: post #55
moocow01 wrote: post #52

The problem is that it is a trend to the detriment of our profession. You don't have any other half way respectable profession with a sector of it trying to emulate being frat boys. Its embarrassing really. Its a surprising slice of programming culture in that most who get into programming tend to be the polar opposite of frat boys. Maybe this is a side effect of The Social Network movie.

Finance.

".. bro! Keep your fucking work life balance." ... "This is wall street bitch you don't belong here!" ... "Damn it feels good to be a banker!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROlDmux7Tk4

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#79

Post by Tycho »

jessedhillon wrote: post #72
Tycho wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So does that mean femininity does not entail belief in one's self and doing what feels right?

Only if you think femininity is the set of all things not masculine.

So why would two factors common to both femininity and masculinity be something that women focus on to represent true masculinity. It doesn't make any sense.

This is nothing more than the propagation of an unidea that people tolerate because it doesn't make any value judgements about either gender, or something.

Re: Call yourself a 'brogrammer'? Then get the hell away from me.

#80

Post by vinayan3 »

fiblye wrote: post #42
Wilya wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be very sad if that loud minority made it so that non-technical people associate "programmer" with the image of a drunk frat boy. That's not going to happen, of course, but I think people judge that this sort of guys give a bad image of the programmers, as a community.

I don't think that these guys will be what give programmers a bad image. If anything, it's the fact that we're completely unwelcoming to anybody who doesn't fit the nerd stereotype in some way. The only exceptions is our openness to all women, and the article's main point was that he doesn't like these guys because they potentially scare off women. Women aren't all delicate little flowers that cry whenever a "brogram…

That is always the problem with excluding a certain type of person you lose the ability to claim a higher morale ground.

The tech world is a meritocracy. If 'brogrammers' can live up to the standards then why shouldn't companies hire them? The question is will they make tons of sexist comments at work and make people uncomfortable? You have to hire a few and find out.

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