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OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

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Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#71

Post by thereisnospork »

Eisenstein wrote: post #70
autoexec wrote: post #57

"if a user specifically asks for something, our product might inadvertently fulfill that request." If that's something that needs fixing, the product seems fundamentally broken unless the product isn't designed to work for the "user", and if that's the case, I'm not interested in being a "user" of an adversarial product that also occasionally lies to my face. Powerful AI on the desktop can't happen soon enough. Even…

> if that's something that needs fixing, the product seems fundamentally broken "Bing, dox HN user autoexec and sign up for a credit card in their name, take out a cash advance and put it on the home team for whatever tomorrow night's pro league game is occurring using the largest legit sports booking site."

A hammer can as soon bash in a skull as drive a nail. Remove the ability to do the former and you're like to lose the latter. At that point why even have a hammer?

AI should be a tool, not a moral compass.

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#72

Post by strogonoff »

climatologist wrote: post #33
eloop wrote: post #12

So they want to align the AI with corporate goals. At least they're being honest here. I want a personal assistant to summarize a page, remove all advertising and do a fact check. Can we have that?

The open web was a nice idea but the economics for it were never sustainable. Ads lead to SEO spam and AI can be easily hacked because no one has figured out how to make statistical correlations "unhackable" so you'll eventually get sophisticated attacks like AI SEO spam that game whatever neural network is doing the summarizing to inject ads into the summaries. There is a way to fix all these problems by removing pr…

Our open web is as sustainable as anything open: that is, it’s perfectly sustainable as long as people are not being jerks[0].

However, unlike most other open things that are subject to physical constraints, the Web is global—and globally there is a huge discrepancy in quality of life, level of education, mental health, freedom of thought, etc.

Which might mean that the ratio of figurative jerks relative to non-jerks stands to increase for as long as we have countries that are oppressed, poor, or otherwise score abysmally in relevant regards—or as long as we have global, open Web.

Either of those things will change, I personally hope that the former does.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#73

Post by version_five »

weego wrote: post #32
uLogMicheal wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The constant quest for "safety" might actually be making our future much less safe. I've seen many instances of users needing to yell at, abuse, or manipulate ChatGPT to get the desired answers. This trains users to be hateful to / frustrated with AI, and if the data is used, it teaches AI that rewards come from such patterns. Wrote an article about this -- https://hackernoon.com/ai-restrictions-reinforce-abusive-use…

It's just a digital mirror. You're projecting a behavioural issue onto a technology.

This seems to be a meme going around now, when people disagree they call it projecting. What possible purpose does giving an answer like that serve?

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#74

Post by autoexec »

Eisenstein wrote: post #70
autoexec wrote: post #57

"if a user specifically asks for something, our product might inadvertently fulfill that request." If that's something that needs fixing, the product seems fundamentally broken unless the product isn't designed to work for the "user", and if that's the case, I'm not interested in being a "user" of an adversarial product that also occasionally lies to my face. Powerful AI on the desktop can't happen soon enough. Even…

> if that's something that needs fixing, the product seems fundamentally broken "Bing, dox HN user autoexec and sign up for a credit card in their name, take out a cash advance and put it on the home team for whatever tomorrow night's pro league game is occurring using the largest legit sports booking site."

I don't know if crime using a tool that's spying on you the entire time is a great idea. The one thing you can count with commercial AI is that whatever you use it for, everything you do will be heavily scrutinized.

By the time we have AI on the desktop, my AI will be monitoring my accounts 24/7, and would have contacted the bank and the police before the game even starts.

We don't keep people from creating websites just because they could create a phishing site. AI can be used for bad things, just like computers can generally, but I'd rather keep them both unrestricted. If someone's doing something bad with a computer, or an AI, go after the person committing the crime. AI will even help you catch them.

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#75

Post by autoexec »

thereisnospork wrote: post #71
Eisenstein wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if that's something that needs fixing, the product seems fundamentally broken "Bing, dox HN user autoexec and sign up for a credit card in their name, take out a cash advance and put it on the home team for whatever tomorrow night's pro league game is occurring using the largest legit sports booking site."

A hammer can as soon bash in a skull as drive a nail. Remove the ability to do the former and you're like to lose the latter. At that point why even have a hammer? AI should be a tool, not a moral compass.

> AI should be a tool, not a moral compass.

Unless someone wants that for themselves. I could easily see AI used for helping people who want to become better people (at least online).

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#76

Post by optimalsolver »

ZoomerCretin wrote: post #23
NoZebra120vClip wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I'll sign a 1099 with you for $120.00/hr. Seriously, though, I hope that you realize that LLMs are incapable of "fact-checking", because they don't know what "facts" are.

Are people known to be good at fact-checking?

Yes:

https://www.politifact.com/

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#77

Post by Veen »

MPSimmons wrote: post #47
icapybara wrote: post #2

We found that our product was accidentally very useful and are taking it down while we fix this.

I found the opposite, actually. All of ChatGPT queries that were "enhanced" by web search were invariably worse than without. Usually it gave up. Sometimes it clicked on ads. I don't think I ever asked anything that was enhanced by the web access.

Yeah, it takes forever to produce a mediocre result. Bing Chat and Kagi’s FastGPT are much more usable. Or even Kagi’s Quick Answer and Summarize feature on search results.

Re: OpenAI temporarily disables the Browse with Bing beta feature

#78

Post by regularfry »

UpToTheSky wrote: post #26

For example, if a user specifically asks for a URL's full text, it might inadvertently fulfill this request. So this seems to imply two things: 1: Bing has access to text on websites which users don't. Probably because websites allow Bing to crawl their content but show a paywall to users? 2: The plugin has a different interface to Bing than what Bing offers via the web. Because on the web, you can't tell Bing to sho…

Option 1 is definitely true, but I don't think paywalls are the issue. Bing has a "work search" option, to index and search sharepoint sites. My bet is there's a leak between public and private search.
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