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How I feel quitting my own startup

aquiles.me

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Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#71

Post by hinkley »

two_in_one wrote: post #42
robocat wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As long as you have significant stock Minority shareholding is actually pretty shitty, as I am sure a few people on this thread would agree.

Most of my savings came from minority stock. It was a nice surprise when I finally moved out. Could be better if I didn't sell it right away, but you never know...

Money from private stock should always be a nice surprise. Don't make it part of your calculus. Having it over your head is how they motivate you. But it becomes all stick.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#72

Post by sashank_1509 »

I think this is mainly an issue of a lack of formal structure. A bad way to start a company with your cofounder is to expect to reach a consensus on decisions and only that moves forward. It’s hard for 2 people to consistently reach consensus, it’s impossible for more than 2. There needs to be a clear formal hierarchy, people lower in the hierarchy can always disagree voice out the thought but they must commit once the decision has been made (Disagree but commit). If as the leader you see employees doing things behind your back, first you fire them especially if it is duplicitous. Then you have a long reflection on why your decisions were bad enough that employees felt the need to do this. It may be time to hire a new CEO if you think you cannot hold employee respect and trust. There is a sort of prevalent myth in Silicon Valley, that friends start startups and the company structure is flat in its initial days. There are far too many examples disproving this (Amazon, Facebook, PayPal etc) and even in the case where you have friendly cofounders, you still find an implicit hierarchy built on respect and trust which is probably the ideal form of hierarchy. However lack of hierarchy is a recipe for a mess of a company, formalizing hierarchy kills a lot of politics.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#73

Post by molsongolden »

throwaway778 wrote: post #14

I’m struggling with making this decision at the moment and it was interesting to read this. I’m not a founder, but I’m the first hire and the first engineer – there since day 2. Six years in, a couple of pivots, and now we have a team of 100 people with a gigantic series A just closed and an excellent PMF. I built most of the product myself – it’s genuinely game-changing and commercial demand is through the roof. Eno…

This reads like reasonably normal high growth growing pains. Miserable but common as everything is constantly breaking (not just the product but organizational systems and processes) as the company piles on new hires and new customer demands.

Communication breaks down completely as you leave the “everybody knows what everybody else is doing” stage and need to figure out coordination across siloed teams and work streams. Many people who were there at the smaller team stage get stuck in that mode of operating and it’s a painful push to formalize communications and build reliable/trustworthy systems.

Someone else mentioned this too but you should be past the 18hr/day phase now. It’s time to start building systems and spreading the work in a more sustainable manner.

Not sure what the situation is over there but it’s common to need to bring in a strong VP Eng who can help firewall the department, push back on unrealistic C-suite demands, counter strong personalities from other teams, and provide more stable prioritization. This is the most effective solution that I’ve seen when an eng team feels under the gun constantly, management is punching through to pressure individuals, people are feeling jerked around, etc.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#74

Post by SOLAR_FIELDS »

opmelogy wrote: post #67
taneq wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds to me like the two perceptions of your previous startup are pretty well aligned. You felt your partner was coasting so you checked out. They felt that you checked out. Maybe they were doing more than you realised, or maybe they were just freeloading.

> You felt your partner was coasting so you checked out. They felt that you checked out. Yes that's basically what happened. I get that this is their perception, but find it funny how much self-awareness is lacking as to what they contributed. I'm still friends with them and still like them, but they are firmly in the camp of "nope" moving forward. > Maybe they were doing more than you realised, or maybe they were ju…

I recently had a similar experience. There was no bad blood in the departure, but what I thought would be more of two people with supplementary experiences coming together ended up feeling more like an employer/employee type of relationship. Like many co-partnerships that end up splitting, one person felt like they were doing all the heavy lifting for too long and that engenders a bit of resentment.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#75

Post by papertigerau »

I've made > 100 pre-seed investments and the #1 cause failure in the first 3 years is founders quitting because of unresolved cofounder conflict. The first time I saw an obviously valuable, fast-growing company blown up because the founders couldn't agree on a $5000 travel expense I was astounded. Now it's something I've grown to expect - just one more risk to be managed.

To try and mitigate this my #1 question each time I meet with the founders I invest in is "how's your relationship with your cofounder(s) going?". If the answer to this question is anything less "fantastic!" we have a long conversation about why, before we talk about anything else.

A low cadence of communication between founders is also correlated with higher failure rates, so another fun question is "when was the last time you spoke with your cofounder?". Again I've stopped being surprised by the amount of founders that answer with "last week/month", which again needs to spark a conversation about why.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#76

Post by nmfisher »

ilamont wrote: post #48
neilv wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on this description, I had to double-check that you weren't a particular founder I know. FWIW, it's not just you; these seem to be non-rare things to happen. One can guess at the likelihood that egos, differing understandings/philosophies, or just plain greed are likely to become a showstopper problem. But, unless it's obvious that the showstopper problems are likely (some people telegraph warning signs heavily…

Cofounder conflict is one of the biggest untold stories of the startup world. Happens all the time, but no one wants to admit the scale of the problem or get into their own specifics.

I'm grateful that I experienced "cofounder mismatch" at a young age (23) and when the stakes were small. Basically, building an app with two friends when one wasn't committed at all, and the other was about half as committed as I was. Ended exactly how you'd expect (though thankfully, we're all still friends).

This is the chief reason why I'm the sole founder of my current venture. I'm not militant about avoiding cofounders (and I have actually scouted), but it would have to be a unicorn who is exceptionally good at the exact things that I'm bad at. Even then, I'd only do it after dipping my toe in over a number of months with smaller projects to gauge their personality and level of commitment.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#77

Post by danielmarkbruce »

papertigerau wrote: post #75

I've made > 100 pre-seed investments and the #1 cause failure in the first 3 years is founders quitting because of unresolved cofounder conflict. The first time I saw an obviously valuable, fast-growing company blown up because the founders couldn't agree on a $5000 travel expense I was astounded. Now it's something I've grown to expect - just one more risk to be managed. To try and mitigate this my #1 question each…

>> I've made > 100 pre-seed investments and the #1 cause failure in the first 3 years is founders quitting because of unresolved cofounder conflict.

Can you comment on the most common cause of conflict? You mention something trivial to make the point that they can be over trivial things, but what is the most common cause of conflict?

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#78

Post by DropInIn »

psyklic wrote: post #62
DelightOne wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can that happen and how do you avoid that happen without ones' own knowledge?

It happened because it all seemed legit -- we were both going all-in, we had the exact share split in writing, did reverse vesting, received founders stock, etc. I even noticed that the shares seemed to exceed the total, and my business partner sent minor corrections, explicitly affirming I had the most shares of anyone. You have to trust your business partner at some point. Legally speaking, my business partner secr…

The way you explain it makes it sound like explicit fraud which is completely actionable....

Or were all communications referenced verbal rather than written?

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#79

Post by psyklic »

DropInIn wrote: post #78
psyklic wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It happened because it all seemed legit -- we were both going all-in, we had the exact share split in writing, did reverse vesting, received founders stock, etc. I even noticed that the shares seemed to exceed the total, and my business partner sent minor corrections, explicitly affirming I had the most shares of anyone. You have to trust your business partner at some point. Legally speaking, my business partner secr…

The way you explain it makes it sound like explicit fraud which is completely actionable.... Or were all communications referenced verbal rather than written?

Every communication referenced was in writing. The equity was only one of many very unsavory things that happened, and I eventually had to hire a lawyer. He suggested we sue and took the case on contingency, but by that time the company had minimal assets.

Re: How I feel quitting my own startup

#80

Post by rendaw »

aqui_c wrote: post #2

I left the startup I co-founded 4+ years ago. The entire process was an emotional roller-coaster. My co-founders (and business partners), who are the majority shareholder, made it abundantly clear that the company was 'theirs'. They made decisions behind my back although I am the only founder working full time on the company. I felt alienated, undervalued, and frankly quite miserable for a while. At some point, when…

How'd you end up as a minority shareholder? I feel like this is a fairly common story, and I'd be interested to know if there are signs/how to avoid it.
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