Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

macrumors.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 225 posts

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#71

Post by dralley »

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #21
cainxinth wrote: post #9

Tim Cook must sweat bullets every time he reads a headline about China potentially invading Taiwan.

Isn't USA in the process of basically relocating TSMC to Arizona for that reason? And it's not for iPhones. It's because USA military can't risk having the chip supply cut off in wartime.

No. What you're missing is that the fabs moving to the US are pretty much just the ones the US military might need.

TSMC isn't moving their cutting edge production here. The fabs will be a node or two behind.

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#72

Post by MichaelZuo »

inkyoto wrote: post #60
JKCalhoun wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm googling this right Apple had perhaps $48B in cash in 2022. I don't know how others compare.

Apple Q2 2023 report indicates USD 166 billion in cash reserves.

I believe that's including things like high liquidity investments and so on, so not quite cash.

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#73

Post by samwillis »

foverzar wrote: post #64
samwillis wrote: post #2

Some people may criticise the "monopoly" Apply have of TSMC latest nodes, but I think it's ultimately good. TSMC need to know they have a customer for new nodes in order to invest in them, thats what Apple are in the unique position to give with their war chest of cash. This investment by Apple eventually leads its way to other customers and smaller businesses. The whole industry thrives on the wake Apple leaves behi…

> TSMC need to know they have a customer for new nodes in order to invest in them I mean, does anyone doubt that thinner process nodes will be in demand?

No, but companies still like to have preorders to pay for the investment, rather than having to empty their savings to raise cash. Apple with the cash they have thrown at TSMC and the almost certain high sales they know they will have, can make pre-emptive moves other companies will struggle to do.

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#74

Post by Maursault »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #36
ftxbro wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like the local-LLM enthusiasts will want to use Apple computers. This is funny to me for some reason, like if the most cost-effective work boot of 2025 is produced by Gucci.

Local LLMs do best on big GPUs, which aren’t an option on Macs. What Apple has done with the M-series silicon is really impressive, but it’s not as fast as big, dedicated GPU silicon. > like if the most cost-effective work boot of 2025 is produced by Gucci. Apple M-silicon laptops are high quality, but they’re not the same as overpriced luxury goods. The price of entry level M1/M2 Macs is extremely reasonable, IMO.

> Local LLMs do best on big GPUs, which aren’t an option on Macs. What Apple has done with the M-series silicon is really impressive, but it’s not as fast as big, dedicated GPU silicon.

It'd be pretty silly for Apple to cram in big, dedicated GPU when 99.9% of their customers don't care and don't want to pay for it, especially considering that anyone that does want big, dedicated GPU can outboard as much GPU as they want.[1] And many seem to think that the onboard GPU along with Neural Engine should be adequate for local LLM.

[1] https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208544

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#75

Post by jjtheblunt »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #58

I’d love some super smart technologist in this forum to give a realistic and practical pathway to disrupting apple in the mobile or “computer” market. Given the fact that Apple has such a dominant position in every part of the supply chain infrastructure I’m challenged with being able to see how any organization could possibly come up with something that pushes Apple into bankruptcy.

Why would you want that?

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#76

Post by kitsunesoba »

madeofpalk wrote: post #46
michaelsshaw wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How improved though? iPhones are already pretty fast. I don't know about you, but i've never compiled a kernel on my phone. Having a faster, actual workstation grade computer would be better. But yeah you're right, sarcasm is the right approach.

There's also energy consumption.

Yep, reducing energy consumption and boosting performance per watt seems to be one of Apple’s main focuses, and for most people buying phones, tablets, and laptops that’s probably the correct choice — while raw perf is nice computers have been “fast enough” for a long time.

People who only browse the web need barely more than a Core 2 Duo, even now, and most devs and media professionals will find an M1 Pro to fill their needs somewhere between reasonably and very well. You know what almost nobody will turn down though? Laptops that are cool to the touch and rarely need to spin up fans and all manner of battery powered device that lasts longer, even doing “real” work.

Of course there will always be those who need the fastest big iron they can find and don’t care if they have to feed it 2000W and cool it a 15lb heatsink with ear piercing fans, but this group is comparatively niche.

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#77

Post by heliophobicdude »

braymundo wrote: post #38
nordsieck wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a little funny... but the combination of pretty good integrated graphics and (potentially) large amounts of on package ram mean that macs are actually a pretty inexpensive way to get access to a GPU with lots of graphics memory.

I wish gaming on Mac became more popular due to the same reason.

What are some broken-down reasons why gaming on Mac didn't take off. I'm sure it's a few different reasons all together

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#78

Post by neogodless »

ricokatayama wrote: post #59

And this is what we call monopsony.

But "3nm" is not the only manufacturing service TSMC sells. They are selling from their other lines to lots of other customers.

What's the overall annual dollar amount TSMC sells, and of that, what percentage is Apple, regardless of the specific production line?

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#79

Post by michaelsshaw »

iknowstuff wrote: post #56
michaelsshaw wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How improved though? iPhones are already pretty fast. I don't know about you, but i've never compiled a kernel on my phone. Having a faster, actual workstation grade computer would be better. But yeah you're right, sarcasm is the right approach.

Haha yes compiling a kernel should be the focus. Forget all the advancements in instant computational photography, on-device voice recognition and Siri, 4K HDR 60fps stabilized videos, 120Hz retina screens running perfectly smooth animations on an all day lasting battery, because neckbeards can't compile a kernel

Using faster computer chips to make faster computers, rather than Apple products, should be the focus, yes.

Re: Apple to occupy 90% of TSMC 3nm capacity in 2023

#80

Post by Etheryte »

andy_ppp wrote: post #4

Is there any projection on when and if Intel will catch TSMC? Seems TSMC keep managing to deliver every single planned process improvement on time.

Given their current pace, Intel isn't catching but falling behind instead. This has been going on for quite a long time now to be honest.
Post reply on HN