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New cars are just for rich people now

jalopnik.com

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Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#71

Post by jandrese »

tehjoker wrote: post #27
PaulHoule wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. Ford saw the automobile as being revolutionary only if the person who makes the automobile is able to afford the automobile. (Funny, nobody applies this one to child care.)

That doesn't make any sense. This sounds like a play for a more loyal labor force, a larger labor force, or to head off unionization. Ford was an incredible asshole that supported Nazi beliefs. He's wasn't going to just give people money.

Making the product cheap enough for the common man to afford is the first and most important step in mass market adoption. You make up the loss in per-vehicle profit with volume and in the end of the day walk home with a lot more money. Ford is saying if a simple factory worker could buy his product he was going to be a rich man.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#72

Post by olyjohn »

glitchc wrote: post #35

Safety is a big factor here. The basic trim for all entry level models includes driving aids such as proximity sensors, blind spot warning, backup camera, pre-collision warning. The changes required to integrate those features into the car are diverse and influence design. The net result is that it's not economically feasible to offer them as optional components on higher trims and the base price of all models goes u…

Meh. I feel like that's a scapegoat that they like to use. Honda packed all that into the Fit (Honda Sensing), and it wasn't a $50,000 car. It was reasonably priced, and an excellent, economical car, with a top safety rating. It's literally the exact same tech used in their top end cars.

But what they did was, they killed the Fit in the US. So now the cheapest Honda car you can get is the Civic. Which isn't the small car it used to be.

I mean also, how much does this tech cost really? A backup camera? You really gonna claim that cars are unaffordable because of a $20 LCD and $10 camera installed into the bumper?

Pre-collision warnings, blind spot monitoring, it's all 20 year old tech now. And it comes in everything.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#73

Post by stagger87 »

chollida1 wrote: post #9
PaulHoule wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. Ford saw the automobile as being revolutionary only if the person who makes the automobile is able to afford the automobile. (Funny, nobody applies this one to child care.)

> Ford saw the automobile as being revolutionary only if the person who makes the automobile is able to make the automobile What is this supposed to mean? I'm not sure if I'm being obtuse or its too profound for me to understand.

You can find a better retelling of this elsewhere, but Ford wanted his employees to be able to purchase Ford cars. The story is often used when discussing the fairness of employees wages, or the cost of goods. Auto employees have long been considered part of the middle class. I think the OP was referring to the fact that probably many of the people making these cars can't even afford them nowadays. Given that cars are practically a necessity in most of the US, I don't think that sits right with people.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#75

Post by jandrese »

danielvaughn wrote: post #53

I'm speaking out of ignorance here, since I have no idea what role a microchip plays in modern vehicles, but obviously it's geared towards software components. Assuming that's true, then this whole chip shortage would have been a great time for someone to bring a software-less, low-tech vehicle to the market. I've personally been wanting that as our last vehicle completely shit the bed when the digital transmission e…

It's generally not possible to meet emissions guidelines without computer control of the engine. Fuel economy also suffers. It's all a tightwire balancing act and the mechanical carburetors of the past are simply too crude to get the job done.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#76

Post by bryanlarsen »

a_subsystem wrote: post #59
falcolas wrote: post #37

If you're purchasing a new vehicle for over $40k, you're getting scammed IMO. There's a lot of great electric and hybrid vehicles with good reliability history. But if you want to look like a _____ in a lifted dodge ram, well, we'll be happy to give you plenty of room on the road to roll your coal.

Show me an electric passenger truck that can pull 20,000 pounds.

Are there any light duty trucks, gas or electric, that can pull 20,000 pounds?

20,000 pounds is well into medium or heavy duty truck territory.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#77

Post by yamtaddle »

ericmay wrote: post #51

Another blow against the "cars = freedom" mantra we have so wrongly pursued for 50+ years. Now that prices are up and highway maintenance costs are continuing to increase you have no alternative but to open your wallet for the automakers and state departments of roads and highways bureaucrats because guess what, they've legislated your density and your sidewalks and bike lanes away and stopped you from taking the tra…

When I ran the numbers for "am I, high-paid for my city and only at a medium-distance from the city center by local commuter standards, benefitting from the existence of cars?" over a decade ago, I was at break-even (except that I'd be healthier in a bike-and-walking-centric version of my city). Now? Haha. Hahaha. If I still had to commute, the numbers would surely be way into the "cars are a net-cost" side. And I've got a far better situation for that than most do....

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#78

Post by olyjohn »

dgoodell wrote: post #23

They say there are fewer new cars available at $21k today than in 2017. Did they take into account inflation? $21k in Jan 2017 is nearly $26k Jan 2023. There seems to be plenty of new cars that cost that amount.

Wages aren't going up with inflation. So if people couldn't afford a $26k car in 2017, how do you think they can afford it now?

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#79

Post by a_subsystem »

jonathankoren wrote: post #40
jen20 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Supply shocks” make it sound like something that could not be anticipated, rather than something that was caused by active incompetence from auto manufacturers at the start of the pandemic.

The supply shocks of checks notes three years ago, were certainly unanticipated. But it's been three years now, and prices haven't come down even though supply problems are clearing up. So what's up with prices? Well, to paraphrase the old sportscaster Warner Wolf, let's just go to the quarterly reports! Around the all the industries profits are setting records while they reassure investors that supply chain price in…

When the government prints more money, all money loses value.

Re: New cars are just for rich people now

#80

Post by sandworm101 »

glitchc wrote: post #35

Safety is a big factor here. The basic trim for all entry level models includes driving aids such as proximity sensors, blind spot warning, backup camera, pre-collision warning. The changes required to integrate those features into the car are diverse and influence design. The net result is that it's not economically feasible to offer them as optional components on higher trims and the base price of all models goes u…

Safety is also the driving factor in vehicle size. We are in an arms race of constantly increasing vehicle complexity and mass. The safest vehicle to be in any two-vehicle crash is almost always the bigger one. With mass comes cost.

The irony is that vehicles are now ridiculously safe in comparison to decades past. Regulators who for years improved safety by leaps and bounds (seat belts, crumple zones, anti-lock breaks etc) are now forced to playing at the margins. Every incremental improvement now comes at greater and greater complexity/mass/cost. Rear view and side mirrors are going away soon, to be replaced by backup cameras. Also are coming anti-drunk features. There is serious talk about interlock breathalyzers being built into all steering wheels. This is going to get much worse.

For those who cannot afford a car but still need to travel the distances, there is always motorcycles. New two-wheeled vehicles are still cheap.

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