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Baker's Math (2009)

thefreshloaf.com

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Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#71

Post by MichaelCollins »

travisjungroth wrote: post #66
MichaelCollins wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the law is about loaves being too light or small, how does giving out an extra loaf to people who buy 12 help? If the baker gives you 13 and calls it 12, that makes it harder for a greedy baker narrative to stick. It doesn't have to be logical, it's about managing impressions. > Who is even buying 12 loaves of bread when restaurants are rare and refrigeration non-existent? The average family used to be the size…

It doesn’t add up that it would just be about managing impressions or controlling a narrative. The fact that there was a law regulating the price of loaves of bread is well recorded. Anyone selling loaves too small but also selling baker’s dozen would be in violation. I regret trying to say buying a dozen would be uncommon. It’s more that even if they sell a dozen, of course there’d frequently be orders smaller than…

Bakers were under constant suspicion of cheating customers and the regulations. Adulterated flour was a big concern too, not just loafs too small or airy. To manage their reputations, I think bakers would rationally take any edge they can get.

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#72

Post by chrisbuc »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #55

I’m surprised how something so basic as learning that baking recipes are ratios of mass makes me feel more comfortable and inclined to try baking than anything ever has before. It’s such a simple concept, and much more approachable to me than I’d expected before I clicked the link.

I've always thought of baking as a science and cooking as an art (although both are on a spectrum from art to science).

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#73

Post by travisjungroth »

MichaelCollins wrote: post #71
travisjungroth wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t add up that it would just be about managing impressions or controlling a narrative. The fact that there was a law regulating the price of loaves of bread is well recorded. Anyone selling loaves too small but also selling baker’s dozen would be in violation. I regret trying to say buying a dozen would be uncommon. It’s more that even if they sell a dozen, of course there’d frequently be orders smaller than…

Bakers were under constant suspicion of cheating customers and the regulations. Adulterated flour was a big concern too, not just loafs too small or airy. To manage their reputations, I think bakers would rationally take any edge they can get.

I totally agree that bakers would give an extra loaf to help their reputation. I seriously doubt this was done as a way to stay in line with the law as the linked article claims.

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#74

Post by jshmrsn »

eps wrote: post #70
mcaravey wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it was an investment for sure. But it has allowed us to save a ton of time every day (e.g. save 30 minute on the autolyse), make tweaks to our recipes to match our processes, change our starters (use stiff levain instead of poolish for certain breads), and a bunch of other details. Not needed for the lay-person. For sourdough I’d opt for the Tartine books.

Autolyse probably is not the best example. I have several bread-making books and I don't think a single one advocates for autolyse. Not Tartine, not Forkish's, not Reinhart's. Lots of youtubers and bloggers love it though, no idea why.

Maybe you’ve already watched it, but Ragusea has a good 15m video on the topic, which goes over the chemistry and some pros and cons. Basically, it’s a trade off of less work (kneading) in exchange for more waiting. I imagine in an industrial context, it’s more efficient to just toss the dough into a machine.

https://youtu.be/orpTeX_EGXA

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#75

Post by mcaravey »

eps wrote: post #70
mcaravey wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it was an investment for sure. But it has allowed us to save a ton of time every day (e.g. save 30 minute on the autolyse), make tweaks to our recipes to match our processes, change our starters (use stiff levain instead of poolish for certain breads), and a bunch of other details. Not needed for the lay-person. For sourdough I’d opt for the Tartine books.

Autolyse probably is not the best example. I have several bread-making books and I don't think a single one advocates for autolyse. Not Tartine, not Forkish's, not Reinhart's. Lots of youtubers and bloggers love it though, no idea why.

Maybe not, but they do look at that one because a bunch of books are totally in favor, and a bunch are either against it or ignore it, so coming up with a definitive answer was a reasonable thing to do. Other examples of time savers would be when to add fats and salts in a dough, and proofing and punching times.

I’d need to double check, but I could have sworn that Tartine did have an autolyse where they have you wait a half hour before adding the salt and last bit of water. I don’t have the book handy at the moment though…

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#76

Post by OJFord »

eps wrote: post #69
mcaravey wrote: post #50

Commercial baker here. One place where this kind of math gets really weird is when the recipe uses multiple kinds of flours. We make a loaf that uses three kinds of flour, so this means a recipe will have flour percentages that are less than 100%, but that sum to 100% so the hydration percentage works. For example, the recipe might say: Bread Flour 80%, Whole Wheat Flour 15%, and Rye Flour 5%. Personally I prefer jus…

> the Modernist Bread set. It’s pricey... $625 is not "pricey", it's ridiculuously expensive.

I'm not so sure, I had the same reaction to your comment, but then clicked through; it's a set of five thick books, essentially a history book, two textbooks, and two recipe books, at $125ea. Pricey, definitely, but phrased like that I think not so ridiculous.

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#77

Post by menage »

eps wrote: post #70
mcaravey wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it was an investment for sure. But it has allowed us to save a ton of time every day (e.g. save 30 minute on the autolyse), make tweaks to our recipes to match our processes, change our starters (use stiff levain instead of poolish for certain breads), and a bunch of other details. Not needed for the lay-person. For sourdough I’d opt for the Tartine books.

Autolyse probably is not the best example. I have several bread-making books and I don't think a single one advocates for autolyse. Not Tartine, not Forkish's, not Reinhart's. Lots of youtubers and bloggers love it though, no idea why.

The Tartine Bread book (as of 2018) explicitly recommends the autolyse/rest period (page 52, with more explanation on page 73).

Re: Baker's Math (2009)

#80

Post by sircastor »

My Baking experience improved substantially for me when I moved to weighing my ingredients instead of measuring by volume. My voice assistant has also been super helpful in quick conversions from recipes.
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