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US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

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Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#71

Look. I know it's HN and we're all very serious business here. And I'm not trying to be age-ist – my condemnation is strictly confined to mental state. But what. the fuck . do we do with these dinosaurs who know nothing of technology policy but have decided to go and make it anyway ? What do we do? The strategy of waiting for them to retire or whatever doesn't seem to be paying off.

As long as we're busy chatting about pet languages, comparing work/life balances, and generally masturbating about startup culture, we (as a collective) aren't going to do a damned thing. It's time to acknowledge that this behavior of our governments is beginning to violate a reasonable social contract, and if not that, certainly at least realize that our livelihoods are coming under attack. It may well be time to st…

You're very right but I believe there's an even deeper problem here. There will always be people trying to manipulate the system to serve their needs but I think we can start winning some of these cases by educating the public. A lot of the people deciding on these issues have no clue how the things they're ruling on works. This judge most likely doesn't know that he just opened the floodgates for abuse.

This judge was a guy most likely like my mother who uses google as her browser address bar. First navigate to goof,e type the web address in search then click the first result. He seems to have been thinking about the issue in terms of the physical world. If someone was using the Chanel name and logo to sell fake goods then an order along these lines in the physical world makes some sense.

A lot of people who don't quote get the web think of these issues with physical analogies in mind. The problem is that these physical world analogies just don't apply. They only sound good to the uninformed. So yeah, we need to be protesting but more importantly we need to be educating. There are far more people who make bad judgements based on ignorance of the web than there are that make bad judgements because they need to please their pay masters.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#72
Practically, this ruling won't have much effect. There's a team of people at Google already dedicated to removing results like these from the index, as they aren't that great for users. Any counterfeit goods site with enough SERP already gets on their radar, and gets removed/demoted, without action from Us courts.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#73
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to invent the following things so we can be forever truly free: 1) A secure, peer to peer DNS system with no registrars and a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 2) An encrypted version of TCP that we can drop in without anyone noticing. 3) A way of distributing keys for our encrypted transport layer without certificate authorities and again with a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 4) A secure, pe…

You can't invent around policy problems.

Sir or madam, with that attitude, I'm surprised you are here, in a place called Hacker News.

A great many of us make good money working around broken systems and architectures. We live for this shit!

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#74

Look. I know it's HN and we're all very serious business here. And I'm not trying to be age-ist – my condemnation is strictly confined to mental state. But what. the fuck . do we do with these dinosaurs who know nothing of technology policy but have decided to go and make it anyway ? What do we do? The strategy of waiting for them to retire or whatever doesn't seem to be paying off.

[deleted]

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#75

Look. I know it's HN and we're all very serious business here. And I'm not trying to be age-ist – my condemnation is strictly confined to mental state. But what. the fuck . do we do with these dinosaurs who know nothing of technology policy but have decided to go and make it anyway ? What do we do? The strategy of waiting for them to retire or whatever doesn't seem to be paying off.

We need to invent the following things so we can be forever truly free: 1) A secure, peer to peer DNS system with no registrars and a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 2) An encrypted version of TCP that we can drop in without anyone noticing. 3) A way of distributing keys for our encrypted transport layer without certificate authorities and again with a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 4) A secure, pe…

Could it be that some or all of these things either already exist or are possible using existing "tools", but are simply not widely known nor in widespread use?

However statements like "all the features that we need or want" are troublesome. How can we possibly agree on those?

What if someone built the low-level, _boring_ "platform", and offered a _simple_ (as little code as possible), _old_, boring but workable conceptual vision, then let all the high-level enthusiasts address (argue about) usability and features?

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't suggest that we need a social network, but your first suggestion isn't too far from the truth. The exact thing needed is very boring, very low-level, and very unsexy, and I believe can be summarized thusly: We need a method for locating hosts on a network graph which does not have a central point of failure and which cannot be easily disabled. We then need a method for authentically routing messages back a…

Yeah, I edited my list to include a CA-free encrypted replacement for TCP, just before I saw your comment. To all the super-geniuses reading this: burn your socialmobilelocal startup to the ground tomorrow and do this instead. Start by watching this Blackhat talk I linked elsewhere in the thread, the guy has the right kind of ideas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7Wl2FW2TcA

ie. if you really want to change the world instead of paying lip service to it and going for the money grab, here's one opportunity.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#77
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to invent the following things so we can be forever truly free: 1) A secure, peer to peer DNS system with no registrars and a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 2) An encrypted version of TCP that we can drop in without anyone noticing. 3) A way of distributing keys for our encrypted transport layer without certificate authorities and again with a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 4) A secure, pe…

You can't invent around policy problems.

Yes you can, if you make the invention critical before they realize the consequences.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But then you'd still be subject to existing laws - it's not like they're going away. With the same amount of effort, you could get the governments to stop making stupid decisions/laws or at least consult someone before they do. But then again, they have tech consultants who never get a say because ruling in favor of those with money is better for the lawmakers' careers or pockets. I do believe that most people are pr…

> you could get the governments to stop making stupid decisions/laws I know we live in an age of hitherto unimagined prosperity and wealth and miracles, but you may be reaching a little too far.

It's not governments that make stupid decisions, it's people; take the decision away from government, and someone else will make those stupid decisions, but stupid they will be.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#79

Look. I know it's HN and we're all very serious business here. And I'm not trying to be age-ist – my condemnation is strictly confined to mental state. But what. the fuck . do we do with these dinosaurs who know nothing of technology policy but have decided to go and make it anyway ? What do we do? The strategy of waiting for them to retire or whatever doesn't seem to be paying off.

the tech/science community is the most able body of people in the country. I'm sure if there coordinated effort was made, it could put technologists in every office in the country.

the most able body of people in the country

Most able at what? Most people who are in elected office, or who have been in elected office, have a certain repertoire of skills in getting along with other people and in keeping track of mutual obligations that helps make the political process work. Some scientists or engineers who become politicians

http://www.whitehouse.gov/about/presidents/jimmycarter

http://mcnerney.house.gov/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vern_Ehlers

http://holt.house.gov/

http://olver.house.gov/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Foster_(Illinois_politicia...

http://sharp.sefora.org/issues/111th-congress-degrees-by-typ...

have had some degree of those skills, and some people with other academic degrees have gained understanding of how science relates to public policy.

http://press.princeton.edu/titles/9226.html

But scientists and engineers are still fallible human beings,

http://yalepress.yale.edu/book.asp?isbn=9780300123852

and the political process will still come under influence of concentrated interest groups

http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/PublicChoice.html

regardless of which people fill the offices.

Re: US judge orders hundreds of sites "de-indexed" from Google, Facebook

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to invent the following things so we can be forever truly free: 1) A secure, peer to peer DNS system with no registrars and a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 2) An encrypted version of TCP that we can drop in without anyone noticing. 3) A way of distributing keys for our encrypted transport layer without certificate authorities and again with a dynamic, heterarchical network of trust. 4) A secure, pe…

I wouldn't suggest that we need a social network, but your first suggestion isn't too far from the truth. The exact thing needed is very boring, very low-level, and very unsexy, and I believe can be summarized thusly: We need a method for locating hosts on a network graph which does not have a central point of failure and which cannot be easily disabled. We then need a method for authentically routing messages back a…

There are some people who consider low-level to be sexy.
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