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Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

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Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#71

Post by formvoltron »

epistasis wrote: post #24

To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste, versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre... Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics should be far more concerning to people. It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a…

Yikes. You are right and I had not thought about tires as an obvious source of microplastics.

What's the solution though?

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#72

Post by gonzo41 »

causality0 wrote: post #55
epistasis wrote: post #24

To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste, versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre... Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics should be far more concerning to people. It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a…

It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. It's really weird how trucks get a pass from people who don't give cars a pass. If tire wear is proportional to road wear, the majority of tire-originating microplastics is from semi trucks, not commuter sedans.

Build more trains, and then make smaller trucks that are locally bound.

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#73

Post by ericd »

josho wrote: post #42
kohanz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure if it was your intent, but that comparison makes the fishing output seem even more outsized to me, given the size of the auto industry.

From a damage perspective the two couldn't be more different as well. Lost fishing gear is large bulky items that trap & kill sealife, damage habitat, etc. Whereas we aren't entirely sure what downsides micro-plastics have, I'm sure over time we'll discover issues. But, where we stand today we know that we have a clear and present danger from the fishing gear.

From a cleanup perspective, I'd much rather have it consolidated into relatively few large chunks...

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#74

Post by ericd »

formvoltron wrote: post #71
epistasis wrote: post #24

To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste, versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre... Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics should be far more concerning to people. It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a…

Yikes. You are right and I had not thought about tires as an obvious source of microplastics. What's the solution though?

Probably lighter vehicles? Wear is superlinear with weight. Unfortunately, EVs aren't great on this axis.

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#75

Post by smileysteve »

julianlam wrote: post #60
Waterluvian wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t that flawed logic? If you’re proposing that one of these issues can be fixed with more infrastructure, then couldn’t either? Rail is nice.

Sure! Rail is nice, when the volume permits it. How would we supply the supermarket, though? A rail line would be unfeasible.

Rail construction and maintenance is super low cost compared to highway and interstates.

The expensive part is buying new rightaways, a private company responsible for liabilities like trespassing, security, and runoff (all of which the highways get subsidized by the public)

If the US spent a small percent of what it does on highways it could reactivate tracks that have shutdown since the 50s, rail towns would rise again and be the central b rural hub for groceries again.

If the US replaced 1 lane of every 6+ lane interstate highway, as due for maintenance..., every major metro would have world class transit in less than a decade (you need 2 lines if you don't use modern safe switchingb at stations)

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#76

Post by epistasis »

formvoltron wrote: post #71
epistasis wrote: post #24

To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste, versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre... Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics should be far more concerning to people. It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a…

Yikes. You are right and I had not thought about tires as an obvious source of microplastics. What's the solution though?

Stop driving. Drastically reduce the amount of vehicle miles travelled. Shift even more freight to train. Much stricter weight limits on vehicles, maybe?

Higher quality tires that wear more slowly may also improve this.

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#78

Post by acabal »

zonotope wrote: post #40
notch656a wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you need recommendations on places in the US you can work in tech without a car and still enjoy the community? Because I can speak from many years of experience, it's not a difficult life to setup for yourself.

I'd love to hear these recommendations. I know you thrive without a car in New York and Boston, but I would love to hear about other places like that in the US.

Chicago IMHO is just about the only place outside of NYC or Boston that you can live a full life car-free, if you live within the right boundary.

The "Chicagoland Area" is huge and includes swaths of "city" that are suburbs in everything but name. But, if you live within, say, the rough bounds of Rogers Park in the north, to Humboldt Park in the west, to South Loop to the south, a car probably won't be strictly necessary. (With exceptions for some inner neighborhoods that are underserved by transit for historic reasons, like Clybourn Corridor.)

The El subway is great by American standards (but not world standards) and the bus system is comprehensive, with many 24 hours lines. You would almost certainly rely mostly on buses as for historic reasons the El subway was designed to service the inner city loop and not the outlying neighborhoods, so it rarely goes exactly where you want to be, unless where you want to be is always the office.

The bummer is having to wait on a bus when it's very cold or snowing out.

Biking is still quite bad by any standard except the jaundiced American one, but slowly improving after some recent high-profile killings of children on bikes.

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#79

Post by trainsarebetter »

julianlam wrote: post #60
Waterluvian wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t that flawed logic? If you’re proposing that one of these issues can be fixed with more infrastructure, then couldn’t either? Rail is nice.

Sure! Rail is nice, when the volume permits it. How would we supply the supermarket, though? A rail line would be unfeasible.

That’s in the law books. In the Netherlands it’s part of the zoning to have a freight line for loading/off loading. It actually takes up much less space compared to truck loading docks. Parking take sup a lot of land.

Re: Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans (2021)

#80

Post by formvoltron »

formvoltron wrote: post #71
epistasis wrote: post #24

To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste, versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre... Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics should be far more concerning to people. It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a…

Yikes. You are right and I had not thought about tires as an obvious source of microplastics. What's the solution though?

I'll answer this one. Well there is a company that created an on vehicle electrostatic filter. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTGCFL6fukY

I wonder also if tires could be made to be just as durable yet biodegradable?

Or could bacteria be introduced to roads that eats these particles? I suppose you don't want to make road slippery though.

Yes I agree to drive less, but this really seems like a pretty big problem that needs some solving. Recent medical studies found microplastics in our bloodstream & lungs. Not good.

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