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Deluge BitTorrent Client

deluge-torrent.org

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Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#71

Post by sph »

wildmanx wrote: post #60
bartvk wrote: post #45

In my opinion, nobody (edit: who values their privacy) should use Deluge. There's an issue where proxy settings are ignored: https://dev.deluge-torrent.org/ticket/2149 It's been open since 10 years, and this is not a great situation for a torrent client. Where torrents are concerned, proxies are explicitly used to protect privacy. Even in this very topic, someone said they were happy with the SOCKS proxy option in De…

For you and everybody else complaining about this aspect: This is open source software. GPL licensed. It's provided as-is. You are free to use it and express what you think about it, and the maintainers are equally free to do with your opinion whatever they like, which includes ignoring it. Clearly, none of the maintainers found this to be a problem. They likely don't need proxy settings for themselves. And they appa…

I hate this philosophy of yours with all my might.

When you put something out there, you should strive to do right by your users. It is fine if you do not have time to fix a particular bug, but communication and asking for help should then be your priorities as maintainer. If 10 years of mostly silence on your part have passed, IMHO you have failed to be an effective open source maintainer.

I understand that open source doesn't offer you any rights or guarantees, but it does not have to be written in a contract to care about your software and its particular shortcomings.

Lastly, if you say a maintainer can do whatever they want with their software, I say that users should be free to be critical of it. There is no attitude in OP, they pointed out that a possibly major security bug still exists and people should be very careful about using it. Being open source doesn't mean nobody should dare criticise you.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#72

Post by EdwardDiego »

bartvk wrote: post #45

In my opinion, nobody (edit: who values their privacy) should use Deluge. There's an issue where proxy settings are ignored: https://dev.deluge-torrent.org/ticket/2149 It's been open since 10 years, and this is not a great situation for a torrent client. Where torrents are concerned, proxies are explicitly used to protect privacy. Even in this very topic, someone said they were happy with the SOCKS proxy option in De…

Welp, it's open source, you've had 10 years to contribute a fix.

If you're going to downvote my comment, please explain in a subsequent comment why it's unreasonable to expect that if this is such an egregious bug, someone would've contributed a fix for it? Or at least, a reproducible test case?

Given they haven't, it's either not that egregious, or the people complaining are people who feel entitled to take without giving.

Which, tbh, probably describes a majority of users of torrent software.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#73

Post by enlyth »

wildmanx wrote: post #63
HideousKojima wrote: post #17

Deluge still hasn't had an official Windows release for 2.x, and it's been that way since 2019. Been using qBittorrent for a while now and like it far more than the (currently outdated) version of Deluge I had been using. Not really sure why this was posted here to be honest.

> Deluge still hasn't had an official Windows release for 2.x, and it's been that way since 2019. This is GPL software made by people in their free time, for free. Apparently, the intersection of "people who want a Windows release", "people who have the skill to do it" and "people who want to do it for free" is empty. If you belong to all 3 groups, then please go ahead and provide a Windows release. If you don't then…

And because it's someone's free time project that doesn't bother to make releases for the most popular computing platform on Earth, it is somehow immune from criticism? Everything OP said is correct.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#74

Post by andrewmackrodt »

bartvk wrote: post #45

In my opinion, nobody (edit: who values their privacy) should use Deluge. There's an issue where proxy settings are ignored: https://dev.deluge-torrent.org/ticket/2149 It's been open since 10 years, and this is not a great situation for a torrent client. Where torrents are concerned, proxies are explicitly used to protect privacy. Even in this very topic, someone said they were happy with the SOCKS proxy option in De…

I've been running deluge in Linux since 2019 (version 2.0+, so considerably newer than the bug report) and it appeared to have been using my SOCKS5 proxy settings correctly; I had applied some extra hardening such as disabling natpmp etc, although I'm not sure if those are required.

However I don't doubt that these kind of leaks could have happened depending on configuration / bugs etc.

Eventually I ended up changing my configuration to run deluge in a VPN container (docker) network namespace so that I could use VPN port forwarding for better speeds (supported by Mullvad).

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#75

Post by EdwardDiego »

sph wrote: post #71
wildmanx wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For you and everybody else complaining about this aspect: This is open source software. GPL licensed. It's provided as-is. You are free to use it and express what you think about it, and the maintainers are equally free to do with your opinion whatever they like, which includes ignoring it. Clearly, none of the maintainers found this to be a problem. They likely don't need proxy settings for themselves. And they appa…

I hate this philosophy of yours with all my might. When you put something out there, you should strive to do right by your users. It is fine if you do not have time to fix a particular bug, but communication and asking for help should then be your priorities as maintainer. If 10 years of mostly silence on your part have passed, IMHO you have failed to be an effective open source maintainer. I understand that open sou…

Or, it's been 10 years because no-one has submitted a reproducible test-case.

At least, I don't see any in that bug report.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#76

Post by bartvk »

dewey wrote: post #62
bartvk wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about whether the client supports one non-essential feature or not. It's about a project that silently ignores a privacy-related setting, which then exposes the fact that people download something.

There's 10 comments by the main developer (Cas) on that specific issue. I wouldn't call that "silently ignores". I support him on Patreon ( https://www.patreon.com/deluge_cas ) where he sometimes posts updates but it's clear that he's very busy with other things (Including going through an illness) so I'm not blaming some open source maintainer for picking up a 10 year old, apparently hard to reproduce issue with a t…

Oh but I don’t blame him either, it’s not a question of pointing fingers.

Saying it’s “likely isn’t used by the majority“ is bad form, in my opinion. You don’t know that. I don’t know either, to be sure, but it makes me personally lose faith in the security aspects of the project.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#77

Post by bartvk »

my80thaccount wrote: post #70
bartvk wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about whether the client supports one non-essential feature or not. It's about a project that silently ignores a privacy-related setting, which then exposes the fact that people download something.

I think they're ignoring it because in practice it is not much of an issue.

Some time ago, there was a Russian developer(s) who built a database that logged all IP addresses connecting to swarms. They then built a nice web frontend for it, to make it searchable. That’s how I found my IP address.

If you think that’s not much of an issue, that’s okay but I definitely didn’t like it.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#78

Post by [deleted] »

Galanwe wrote: post #56
bartvk wrote: post #45

In my opinion, nobody (edit: who values their privacy) should use Deluge. There's an issue where proxy settings are ignored: https://dev.deluge-torrent.org/ticket/2149 It's been open since 10 years, and this is not a great situation for a torrent client. Where torrents are concerned, proxies are explicitly used to protect privacy. Even in this very topic, someone said they were happy with the SOCKS proxy option in De…

Out of curiosity, which feature of the client uses HTTP? I thought BitTorrent was a protocol on top of e.g. TCP, is it carried inside HTTP by some clients?

[deleted]

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#79

Post by wildmanx »

enlyth wrote: post #73
wildmanx wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Deluge still hasn't had an official Windows release for 2.x, and it's been that way since 2019. This is GPL software made by people in their free time, for free. Apparently, the intersection of "people who want a Windows release", "people who have the skill to do it" and "people who want to do it for free" is empty. If you belong to all 3 groups, then please go ahead and provide a Windows release. If you don't then…

And because it's someone's free time project that doesn't bother to make releases for the most popular computing platform on Earth, it is somehow immune from criticism? Everything OP said is correct.

Sure it's correct.

It's raining outside right now and I don't like it. That's also a correct statement. Just because it comes from the sky doesn't make it "somehow immune from criticism". But that's not a very meaningful complaint. I can complain about the rain all day. Will it change anything? No.

In contrast to the rain, some feature missing in some open source project can be fixed. Put your energy into complaining or into fixing. Your choice.

In a proprietary system, your only option is to complain. Sadly, it's common to see this mentality for open source projects too.

Re: Deluge BitTorrent Client

#80

Post by wildmanx »

unethical_ban wrote: post #67
wildmanx wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Deluge still hasn't had an official Windows release for 2.x, and it's been that way since 2019. This is GPL software made by people in their free time, for free. Apparently, the intersection of "people who want a Windows release", "people who have the skill to do it" and "people who want to do it for free" is empty. If you belong to all 3 groups, then please go ahead and provide a Windows release. If you don't then…

It's nice to get the old slashdot vibe of "it's open source, any complaint is invalid, learn programming and GUIs and fix it yourself".

I'm not saying it's an invalid complaint. But it's not particularly helpful or meaningful. It's not like the maintainers are not aware of the issue. It's just that they've so far had other priorities in life. To keep complaining won't change that. (Well, maybe it will, but that would actually be pretty sad.)

It's a different story when some issue is brought up the very first time because somebody wasn't aware who would like to be aware and also willing to do something about it. But to just keep complaining beyond a certain point is just a waste of energy. (Especially for an issue that clearly many people don't care about, including users.)

P.S.: I'm not sure why you need to "learn GUIs" for this. This is clearly an issue in the server part of the client/server model that Deluge has. Which is a very nice design choice, if you ask me. Not just for users, but also for developers -- you don't need to have any clue about GUIs to fiddle with the network-related part of the program. EDIT: Sorry, confused this with the parallel subthread about the proxy issue. Yes, for a Windows port you may need to know some GUI aspects.

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