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The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

nature.com

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Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#71

Post by rapind »

dash2 wrote: post #13

The fact that they "controlled" for genetics using polygenic scores already is a strong sign of low quality research. Polygenic scores are powerful, but they contain very large amounts of noise compared to the true genetic effects. Controlling for genetics using them is like controlling for income by asking whether the respondents own a Porsche. Also, be aware that Scientific Reports is, if not quite a predatory jour…

> If you wanna believe that your hours on COD have made you a genius, go ahead, I won't stop you. Just don't imagine that this research proves it.

Video games, like all things, should not all be treated equal. I could certainly see problem solving skills developing from world building or highly complex games (Civ, PoE, etc.). In fact, most (but not all) highly successful games have depth, which requires time investment and problem solving. The difference in games can be as varied as comparing a marketing pamphlet to Asimov's novels.

I don't dispute your take on the quality of the research though. I would even go further and speculate it would be really really hard to come up with meaningful tests due to game variance. So most anything on the subject is likely fluff.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#72

Post by Peku »

brightball wrote: post #36
christophilus wrote: post #5

I’ve tried to encourage my wife to choose video games over Disney+ when she needs to drop the kids in front of something, but she still has a strong resistance to the idea that games are better. To me, it’s pretty obvious. The kids problem solve when gaming, and are obviously engaged. When watching TV, they look like zombies. I think my wife’s biggest hang up with games is that she was always told that they rot your…

Nintendo games on a console that don’t need an internet connection or include advertising. These have been the best combination for our kids where they have fun but aren’t addicted and can easily put them down. The moment games include advertising they optimize for all the wrong things. I won’t let my kids get free games on iPad, etc for this reason alone.

Agreed. The constant dopamine hit with sounds and flashing colors set a horrible precedence. It's bad enough television advertisements hit all the right spots, now video games are a minefield their selves.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#73

Post by isolli »

brightball wrote: post #36
christophilus wrote: post #5

I’ve tried to encourage my wife to choose video games over Disney+ when she needs to drop the kids in front of something, but she still has a strong resistance to the idea that games are better. To me, it’s pretty obvious. The kids problem solve when gaming, and are obviously engaged. When watching TV, they look like zombies. I think my wife’s biggest hang up with games is that she was always told that they rot your…

Nintendo games on a console that don’t need an internet connection or include advertising. These have been the best combination for our kids where they have fun but aren’t addicted and can easily put them down. The moment games include advertising they optimize for all the wrong things. I won’t let my kids get free games on iPad, etc for this reason alone.

My daughter is transitioning from children's games to pre-teen games, and I can't find a single acceptable game on the tablet.

Until now I hadn't realized how sensible Apple's rules around children's games had been, notably: no internet connection required, and no ads.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#74

Post by watwut »

christophilus wrote: post #5

I’ve tried to encourage my wife to choose video games over Disney+ when she needs to drop the kids in front of something, but she still has a strong resistance to the idea that games are better. To me, it’s pretty obvious. The kids problem solve when gaming, and are obviously engaged. When watching TV, they look like zombies. I think my wife’s biggest hang up with games is that she was always told that they rot your…

Very very honestly, my experience with people who watch Disney too much is much much better then with excessive gamers. Only one of those groups yells, swears and is vent their anger at people around when they loose the match.

For the record, my kids do play games, I never did complete ban. But, the gaming does not seem to be superior, does not zombify them less nor leads to more inventive play after session finished.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#75

Post by d3ckard »

lettergram wrote: post #59
throwingrocks wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your response seemed reasonable, and I was nodding along until the last paragraph. I get the impression you had your mind made up about video games and intelligence long before this study was published.

I think the point the prior commenter was making was that this research validates people who think gaming is good. They pointed out the issues and said “if you still want to believe this, I can’t stop you” The commenter may have a bias, but most prior research shows us the opposite of the study. I also saw the poor experimental design and had a similar thoughts. Basically, this research looks poorly done and like an…

In any case, using CoD as an example does not exactly show good will.

I personally believe in huge gains from gaming, based on personal experience (so obviously n = 1, read further accordingly).

Platformers train hand-eye coordination and pattern recognition, strategies teach resource management, RPGs about optimization and adopting growth mindset, racing games require long-time concentration, puzzlers and adventure games test your logic.

In general, games require you to: - learn a set of tools - master them - conquer objective

while also prevailing in face of adversity.

I never regretted the hours I spent gaming and I feel they contributed very much to my softeng career (not directly though).

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#76

Post by Peku »

thr0wawayf00 wrote: post #15
Mandelmus wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Games are designed to be addictive It depends strongly on kind of game, and especially on the business model involved. Gacha games, free-to-play, and similar models are very much optimised around addictiveness. Personally I've found that story-based finite games, i.e. the ones you play through and then you've experienced it, are much better in those respects. Unfortunately those seem to become much more rare these d…

> i.e. the ones you play through and then you've experienced it, are much better in those respects. This has not been my experience at all. It's very easy for me to play a few rounds of rocket league and keep my daily game time to under an hour. When I play stuff like Zelda BOTW though, I have to use the parental controls on myself or else I'll spend half of my day on it.

I think BOTW, while it has a beginning and ending, is much more open than some other games where you're on a structured path.

However I think it speaks that everyone has a different approach and solution to how they play games. It then becomes interesting to see what they play and how they limit their self.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#77

Post by bamboozled »

mrtksn wrote: post #33
christophilus wrote: post #5

I’ve tried to encourage my wife to choose video games over Disney+ when she needs to drop the kids in front of something, but she still has a strong resistance to the idea that games are better. To me, it’s pretty obvious. The kids problem solve when gaming, and are obviously engaged. When watching TV, they look like zombies. I think my wife’s biggest hang up with games is that she was always told that they rot your…

I recall, when I was a kid the games were extremely addictive for me and I couldn't just quit playing unless I absolutely have to. I had emotionally very similar experience when quitting smoking, the feeling that if I just can have this one more smoke I will be satisfied and live happily thereafter is very similar to the desire to have one more round. So I wouldn't call games "not addictive". If anything, watching so…

What about neither TV or computer games and doing things outside like fishing, hiking, scouts, riding bikes etc ?

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#78

Post by BlargMcLarg »

watwut wrote: post #74
christophilus wrote: post #5

I’ve tried to encourage my wife to choose video games over Disney+ when she needs to drop the kids in front of something, but she still has a strong resistance to the idea that games are better. To me, it’s pretty obvious. The kids problem solve when gaming, and are obviously engaged. When watching TV, they look like zombies. I think my wife’s biggest hang up with games is that she was always told that they rot your…

Very very honestly, my experience with people who watch Disney too much is much much better then with excessive gamers. Only one of those groups yells, swears and is vent their anger at people around when they loose the match. For the record, my kids do play games, I never did complete ban. But, the gaming does not seem to be superior, does not zombify them less nor leads to more inventive play after session finished…

Because competitive games are a cesspit. Even games with highly competitive PvE aspects have this problem (MMOs, most notably). Ironically, those are also the games which allow for the highest time investment for the common player. Mostly because everyone is online and anonymous, which subsequently keeps their filters from activating.

By comparison, I've never had a local game of Mario Party remotely as heated as the average experience in a competitive, online game. Not even after Chance Time did the unthinkable.

The downsides of Disney are a little more subtle, too.

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#79

Post by anthonypasq »

throwoutway wrote: post #29
trelane wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games are designed to be addictive, so restraint is a good option. So is television, though, so limiting both is a good policy. I would guess that games' interactivity and personalization lead to much more opportunities for deeper addiction, though (see e.g loot boxes.)

Are old games designed to be addictive? The original NES and Sega games? Like Mario Bros, etc? I think more recent games added the addictive components

whats the difference between fun and addictive?

Re: The impact of digital media on children’s intelligence

#80

Post by psiops »

bamboozled wrote: post #77
mrtksn wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recall, when I was a kid the games were extremely addictive for me and I couldn't just quit playing unless I absolutely have to. I had emotionally very similar experience when quitting smoking, the feeling that if I just can have this one more smoke I will be satisfied and live happily thereafter is very similar to the desire to have one more round. So I wouldn't call games "not addictive". If anything, watching so…

What about neither TV or computer games and doing things outside like fishing, hiking, scouts, riding bikes etc ?

Way too dangerous! Injury, skin cancer, pedophiles, drugs, terrorists, need I go on?
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