I’ll side with Epic when they agree to let me sideload skins in Fortnite. Open your platform, Epic!
Fortnite skins are a store, not a marketplace. There's a big difference.
Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
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Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#72While I generally agree with Epic's positions, it seems like a bit of a stretch here, considering that Android allows both sideloading and alternative app stores. Unlike on iOS, there's nothing on Android stopping Bandcamp from releasing a standalone sideloadable app with any payment system they desire.
Antitrust rules apply for abuse of dominant market power (which Google certainly has) even if theoretical alternatives exist. It does not matter that it's not literally a monopoly, as that is not the legal bar that needs to be passed for Google to be limited in what they can and can't do.
>Antitrust rules apply for abuse of dominant market power (which Google certainly has)
Antitrust rules apply to monopolies, and Google has no where near monopoly over app stores or phones, the relevant systems here.
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#73Earlier quoted context omitted.
When you bought software at a retail store, the vendor didn't get the full retail price. It's not the platform getting a cut, it's the store. What we need to ensure is that platforms can't force you into their store.
As far back as the 80’s there were means of distributing software without paying a retailer a commission on every sale. Shareware [1] was one such model. The software was distributed by users copying it from floppy to floppy, handing it out at user group meetings, conferences, even on the school playground. It was later included in large CD-ROM collections packaged with computer magazines. The point is that you could…
I think this might be more compelling if Epic were the ones hosting the download, and Google were just like, listing the download in their listings, where the download button would go to Epic's servers.
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly. Epic have their own store for games. Would they be fine with each AAA game releasing on the store for “free” but required a credit card to be entered once it was run, with 100% of the money going to the publisher?
Yes, the Epic store enables this exact scenario. Lots of free games on Epic make all of their month through micro transactions billed entirely through their own systems. See Rocket League for one example, but there are many.
I really unsure about EGS monetization model, but Psyonix (developer of Rocket League) are subsidiary of Epic.
UPD: At least while ago in 2019 Epic claimed to give a choice of payment processor to use for games on their store: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2019-12-06-epic-games...
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#75Earlier quoted context omitted.
Antitrust rules apply for abuse of dominant market power (which Google certainly has) even if theoretical alternatives exist. It does not matter that it's not literally a monopoly, as that is not the legal bar that needs to be passed for Google to be limited in what they can and can't do.
>which Google certainly has You’re conflating some ideas here. A marketplace owner always has “dominant market power” over the market they own. That’s the nature of marketplace, the owner gets to set certain rules like the types of payments accepted at the marketplace, because that is literally the job of a marketplace. Google also has dominant market share, since their App Store is the best for android, but that’s l…
One of things revealed because of the whole Fortnite issue was that Google squashed Epic's attempt to bundle their Android app with various OEMs.
Google controls the platform and they're the ones who set up scary warnings for installing apps via sideloading (despite malicious apps being not uncommon in the Play Store itself.)
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#76While I generally agree with Epic's positions, it seems like a bit of a stretch here, considering that Android allows both sideloading and alternative app stores. Unlike on iOS, there's nothing on Android stopping Bandcamp from releasing a standalone sideloadable app with any payment system they desire.
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Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#77I’ll side with Epic when they agree to let me sideload skins in Fortnite. Open your platform, Epic!
Fortnite skins are a store, not a marketplace. There's a big difference.
While this is an absolutely true statement that distinction is an active choice by Fortnite to monopolize their platform.
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
At least in Android it is already the case, I have installed both F-Droid and Huawei's AppGallery in an otherwise stock android. (And prefer to get as much as possible from F-Droid) Apple on the other hand has a war against "evil" sideloading. :P
> At least in Android it is already the case There are roadblocks and deficiencies though, a major one being that sideloaded app stores cannot automatically update their applications, making them permanently inferior and crippled compared to Google's offering.
Also, some apps from F-Droid are crippled compared to what they can do when downloading from Play Store, eg. the K9 mail app from F-Droid doesn't have support for push email, it can only check at intervals.
I don't know what the reason for this is, but the result is that Android is not a truly "open" platform.
Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly. Epic have their own store for games. Would they be fine with each AAA game releasing on the store for “free” but required a credit card to be entered once it was run, with 100% of the money going to the publisher?
Yes, the Epic store enables this exact scenario. Lots of free games on Epic make all of their month through micro transactions billed entirely through their own systems. See Rocket League for one example, but there are many.
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Re: Epic is asking a court to stop Google from yanking Bandcamp off the Play Store
#80Earlier quoted context omitted.
Antitrust rules apply for abuse of dominant market power (which Google certainly has) even if theoretical alternatives exist. It does not matter that it's not literally a monopoly, as that is not the legal bar that needs to be passed for Google to be limited in what they can and can't do.
>Antitrust rules apply for abuse of dominant market power (which Google certainly has) Antitrust rules apply to monopolies, and Google has no where near monopoly over app stores or phones, the relevant systems here.
Antitrust rules apply to monopolies
No, they don't. Most antitrust cases don't involve monopolies, since those are actually quite rare, and most monopolies don't involve anticompetitive behavior.
Antitrust is about regulating anticompetitive market activities, which ranges from price fixing to monopolies.