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App Store: I'm out

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Re: App Store: I'm out

#71

Post by netcan »

benjamincanfly wrote: post #39
netcan wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a bit of truth in it. Not necessarily the comparison to a diet, but still. Becoming indignant & saying 'I'm out' is not useful. There's a potential snag here. It is a man made snag that's unfair , unreasonable or whatever. But that doesn't mean the opportunity isn't there. It's not really more of a reason not to develop then any other reason that isn't unfair: too hard, too much competition, etc. The only di…

The difference is that it's unpredictable, based on Apple's whims. If they said "Hey, here is a list of apps we won't accept from third party developers because we consider them to be competitive," that would be one thing. But as it stands, we don't even know where the line in the sand is, because the line is based on Apple's best interests, not those of the developers. Dozens of developers have released apps that du…

Unpredictable? Yes. So is consumer demand.

It's not just difficult, it's demoralizing.

That's my point. On the rational front, it's not different to 1000 other variables. On the emotional one, it's a lot worse.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#72

Post by mattmaroon »

dcurtis wrote: post #63
mattmaroon wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being on a phone with a dedicated keypad will help more than any software. Android's strength is largely not software. The software only has to be passable, and there's no way the Alliance will let it not be that.

Are you serious? All Android is is software. It just happens to support a lot of different types of hardware, and the first phone has a dedicated keyboard. And saying it will help more than anything is certainly a matter of your opinion. At the end of the day, the only thing that matters is the experience-- a combination of the software, the hardware, and the network.

It's mostly hardware/network though. People buy phones for many different reasons, which necessitates many different form factors. For instance, someone who actually used their phone as a phone would be ill-served by an iPhone, but not by some Android units. Same with people who do a lot of emailing/texting.

So I didn't really mean the keypad specifically.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#73

Post by vlad »

Xichekolas wrote: post #60
boredguy8 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened with Palm, then?

Palm's products were stable, with a good developer environment, but the hardware itself started to look ancient compared to the PDAs that HP and others were offering at the time. Seems like Palm did the software part great, and failed majorly on keeping the hardware up to date (they missed the boat or were late to the party on flash memory cards, color screens, and wireless, that I can remember anyway).

I disagree with almost every point. Palm had flash memory, color screens, and wireless before, or with, everyone else. (I do concede that they made incremental hardware "improvements" with every new Treo, instead of researching and adding innovative features.)

On the other hand, Palm did not add features to their operating system for what must be 7 years now. They did go up a version by adding 320x320 resolution support, but it was more of a hack than anything else. Each individual component (app, database) was still limited to 64k in size from what I recall. Palm was run by business people (more so than Android and the iPhone have since) who thought incremental updates of screen and camera resolution and doubling the onboard memory from 32MB to 64MB were good enough improvements each year.

Palm also did not have a Blackberry-like push e-mail app until maybe two years ago (and even that was because of a third party e-mail app; the default app that Palm owned and installed with every Treo did not even support IMAP.) But around the same time as adding IMAP support by purchasing the rights to a 3rd party e-mail client, they decided to start supporting Microsoft Exchange and running Windows Mobile on half of their new devices every year.

What happened? Apple fans originally loved PalmOS because it wasn't Microsoft. It was based on Apple's Newton. Secondly, the Palms worked better with Apple computers than Microsoft's devices did. Third, supporting the Palm could prevent Microsoft from dominating the mobile world on top of the PC world. Finally, Palm "sold out" and went with Windows Mobile, instead of improving or rewriting their aging operating system.

With the iPhone, Mac lovers could now get a real, current Apple product. I think that was the greatest gift to Mac users and Palm fans who were getting sick of Palm's insignificant incremental improvements.

Now if by software you mean the freedom anyone has to write and distribute a 3rd party app for a Palm device, then yes, they are still the easiest to release apps for. A developer doesn't need anybody's permission except that of the user themselves. But as far as the software PalmOS created and owned--such as the operating system and mail client--only minor improvements were made over the past seven years.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#74

Post by natrius »

jrockway wrote: post #67
Create wrote: post #66

"I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that..." The 5 real reasons to avoid iPhone 3G: * iPhone completely blocks free software. Developers must pay a tax to Apple, who becomes the sole authority over what can and can't be on everyone's phones. * iPhone endorses and supports Digital Restrictions Management (DRM) technology. * iPhone exposes your whereabouts and provides ways for others to track you without your knowl…

Can you quit spamming this comment to every thread that mentions the iPhone? (See http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303708 for example.) It is especially annoying because your use of code formatting for text stretches the page and makes the other comments unreadable.

Workaround: Install Stylish (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/2108) and add "pre { white-space: pre-wrap; }" for this domain.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#75

Post by shard »

apu wrote: post #42
henning wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's stupid. If someone makes a better podcatcher than Apple for the iPhone, the iPhone does podcasting better than before which sells more iPhones, which makes Apple richer. I don't see why it's such a threat. Any time you implement a feature for a product you have to do it in a way that can't possibly please everyone. If you let your developers implement alternative versions, it's conceivable you could get close…

That might be the logical conclusion, but I don't think Apple sees it that way. They've never been very big on this "third-party" stuff...

They've changed their tune ever since the iPod (hmm unintentional pun). A huge industry exists to make iPod compatible products. Apple is never going to make an iDJ.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#76

Post by jrockway »

natrius wrote: post #74
jrockway wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you quit spamming this comment to every thread that mentions the iPhone? (See http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=303708 for example.) It is especially annoying because your use of code formatting for text stretches the page and makes the other comments unreadable.

Workaround: Install Stylish ( https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/2108 ) and add "pre { white-space: pre-wrap; }" for this domain.

Amusing. I saw the word "Stylish" and wondered how someone got it working in Firefox:

http://git.jrock.us/?p=Server-Stylish.git;a=summary

I had the name first! :)

Re: App Store: I'm out

#77

Post by gills »

benjamincanfly wrote: post #39
netcan wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a bit of truth in it. Not necessarily the comparison to a diet, but still. Becoming indignant & saying 'I'm out' is not useful. There's a potential snag here. It is a man made snag that's unfair , unreasonable or whatever. But that doesn't mean the opportunity isn't there. It's not really more of a reason not to develop then any other reason that isn't unfair: too hard, too much competition, etc. The only di…

The difference is that it's unpredictable, based on Apple's whims. If they said "Hey, here is a list of apps we won't accept from third party developers because we consider them to be competitive," that would be one thing. But as it stands, we don't even know where the line in the sand is, because the line is based on Apple's best interests, not those of the developers. Dozens of developers have released apps that du…

You hit it on the head. Players leave rigged markets once they get burned once or twice, and pretty soon the market freezes up altogether.

Withdrawing from iPhone app development is the rational choice. There are other things developers like the author can work on with similar payoffs, but more predictable risks.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#78

Post by viae »

vlad wrote: post #73
Xichekolas wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Palm's products were stable, with a good developer environment, but the hardware itself started to look ancient compared to the PDAs that HP and others were offering at the time. Seems like Palm did the software part great, and failed majorly on keeping the hardware up to date (they missed the boat or were late to the party on flash memory cards, color screens, and wireless, that I can remember anyway).

I disagree with almost every point. Palm had flash memory, color screens, and wireless before, or with, everyone else. (I do concede that they made incremental hardware "improvements" with every new Treo, instead of researching and adding innovative features.) On the other hand, Palm did not add features to their operating system for what must be 7 years now. They did go up a version by adding 320x320 resolution supp…

If I remember correctly there was a great deal of hope that Palm would turn-around when it acquired Be. They royally messed up the next-gen OS that they created using the BeOS/BeIA properties they acquired in a move that reminded me of Apple's Copeland fiasco.

It's been all downhill since.

Re: App Store: I'm out

#79

Post by jcl »

nailer wrote: post #61
aschobel wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to a Reuters September 23rd is when the first Android device comes out for T-Mobile. http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/10/t-mobile-to-offer-android...

That's a really poor looking device. Regardless of the software, Android needs a design conscious handset in order to compete with Apple, HTC or RIM.

That is an HTC phone.
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