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AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

technologyreview.com

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Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#71

Post by iamstupidsimple »

dontreact wrote: post #23

The silly thing here is that it’s very easy to train models nowadays, so the medical AI space is very noisy. With the right data and the right application, this technology can definitely be helpful. However, it is very hard to sort out signal from noise since any reasonably competent undergrad can throw a convnet at some images and get an AUC. Actually, I have even seen a high school science fair where they did a med…

I'm not sure if this has been attempted, so please do correct me, but I would very much like to see AI models designed to assist rather than give coarse classifications like "X disease detected". The best example I can think of would be creating bounding boxes around specific tells, or listing specific markers that a clinician would be looking for themselves, leaving the final decision up to them.

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#74

Post by Leparamour »

selimthegrim wrote: post #38
kQq9oHeAz6wLLS wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, back when Harris and Biden both said they were hesitant to get a vaccine produced under Trump, they kinda set the stage for the dumpster fire we have today.

The point was if he rushed it. The companies delayed their announcement and strengthened the trials so the current Trumpista favorite argument would in theory lose steam.

>The companies delayed their announcement and strengthened the trials so the current Trumpista favorite argument would in theory lose steam.

They [Pfizer] delayed the announcement to three days after the elections. I'm sure those three days were critical in testing and making the vaccine safe for the consumer./s

It was an obvious political move to deny back-then US president Trump a public success as a consequence from him enacting "Operation Warp Speed".[0][1][2]

Also, "Trumpista"? You must feel really clever and enlightened.

[0] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2020/nov/20/trump-...

[1] https://outline.com/bH8vBM

[2] https://jewishjournal.com/news/314659/biden-is-backed-by-bot...

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#75

Post by parineum »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #31

Should have built AI tools to educate the ignorant populace and encourage them to get a vaccine. I know there have to be tons of adboys and girls out there whose only job is to persuade people to do something that could have knocked this out of the park. I see we are still at about 50% vaccination and Walmart is begging people to come get a free vaccine. I’m sorry my tone is negative but this is really getting me fru…

I've been telling people that the way to get people to take the vaccine would be to give Trump credit for operation lightspeed (which I think he deserves but that's irrelevant) and start referring to the vaccine as Trump's Vaccine.

I'm okay with handing Trump a win if it can help save lives and end this pandemic.

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#76

Post by doovd »

trhway wrote: post #68
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #31

Should have built AI tools to educate the ignorant populace and encourage them to get a vaccine. I know there have to be tons of adboys and girls out there whose only job is to persuade people to do something that could have knocked this out of the park. I see we are still at about 50% vaccination and Walmart is begging people to come get a free vaccine. I’m sorry my tone is negative but this is really getting me fru…

>to educate the ignorant populace ok, lets educate. And before educating others lets educate ourselves. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/30/cdc-study-shows-74percent-of... "About three-fourths of people infected in a Massachusetts Covid-19 outbreak were fully vaccinated, according to new data published Friday by the CDC. The new data, published in the U.S. agency’s Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report, also found that f…

The vaccine doesn't stop you from getting covid. It reduces the effects so you're less likely to need hospitalization. So saying x% of people with covid are vaccinated doesn't mean much. There's some education for you.

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#77

Post by trhway »

doovd wrote: post #76
trhway wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>to educate the ignorant populace ok, lets educate. And before educating others lets educate ourselves. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/30/cdc-study-shows-74percent-of... "About three-fourths of people infected in a Massachusetts Covid-19 outbreak were fully vaccinated, according to new data published Friday by the CDC. The new data, published in the U.S. agency’s Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report, also found that f…

The vaccine doesn't stop you from getting covid. It reduces the effects so you're less likely to need hospitalization. So saying x% of people with covid are vaccinated doesn't mean much. There's some education for you.

>The vaccine doesn't stop you from getting covid.

lets that sink. Especially considering that according to the above mentioned CDC data infected vaccinated people spread virus as infected unvaccinated.

>It reduces the effects so you're less likely to need hospitalization.

So, as current vaccines don't stop infection and spread, why would the most of the population whose risk of hospitalization is very low need (and even forced) to vaccinate?

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#78

Post by azinman2 »

parineum wrote: post #75
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #31

Should have built AI tools to educate the ignorant populace and encourage them to get a vaccine. I know there have to be tons of adboys and girls out there whose only job is to persuade people to do something that could have knocked this out of the park. I see we are still at about 50% vaccination and Walmart is begging people to come get a free vaccine. I’m sorry my tone is negative but this is really getting me fru…

I've been telling people that the way to get people to take the vaccine would be to give Trump credit for operation lightspeed (which I think he deserves but that's irrelevant) and start referring to the vaccine as Trump's Vaccine. I'm okay with handing Trump a win if it can help save lives and end this pandemic.

Totally agree. I’ve been thinking the same, and it’s odd to me that he didn’t go that route to begin with. You’d think he’d be all over it.

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#79

Post by criticaltinker »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #31

Should have built AI tools to educate the ignorant populace and encourage them to get a vaccine. I know there have to be tons of adboys and girls out there whose only job is to persuade people to do something that could have knocked this out of the park. I see we are still at about 50% vaccination and Walmart is begging people to come get a free vaccine. I’m sorry my tone is negative but this is really getting me fru…

I understand your frustration, but the condescending remarks are not conducive to wholesome scientific discussion.

Diversity is the way nature builds robust and balanced ecosystems - AI tools that reinforce ideological homogeneity could be catastrophic, for reasons I consider self-evident.

Returning to the topic at hand, and as a counterpoint to your claims, there are legitimate second and third order effects to consider regarding vaccines and the evolutionary dynamics of SARS-CoV-2. Don't take my word for it - here is peer-reviewed research from the brightest minds and top institutions in the world, raising serious concerns about approaching eradication of the virus purely through mRNA vaccines in their current form [1].

I cannot emphasize enough that the spirit of science is to question assumptions and rigorously prove hypothesis.

[1] Risk of rapid evolutionary escape from biomedical interventions targeting SARS-CoV-2 spike protein (April 2021) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33909660/

Re: AI tools have been built to catch Covid, but none of them helped

#80

Post by oezi »

throwawayboise wrote: post #41
selimthegrim wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point was if he rushed it. The companies delayed their announcement and strengthened the trials so the current Trumpista favorite argument would in theory lose steam.

No. They didn't want Trump to have that "win." It was purely political. The vaccines they are pushing now are the very same ones that were developed and tested while Trump was in office.

It certainly wasn't purely political. It was based on the idea that the decision to approve the vaccine is the job of the FDA and that they have to pass their safety and effectiveness verdict.

The US FDA was among the first world-wide to approve (Europe was months later) which in my mind shows that there is not much to an argument that political forces delayed the announcement (and how could the opposition / democrats influence a government institution such as the FDA if the ruling party couldn't? Please no deep state bonkers).

> The vaccines they are pushing now are the very same ones that were developed and tested while Trump was in office.

I would challenge that Trump should receive any political credit for supporting the development of the vaccines, because when the development was happening at Moderna (US) and BionTech (Germany) in spring 2020 Trump was still rejecting SARS-COV-19 as irrelevant. Trump should receive credit for Warpspeed that made sure the production of the developed vaccines is happening and is happening in a way that benefits the American people first (to great frustration to many Europeans).

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