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'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

bbc.com

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Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#71

Post by guerrilla »

mrtksn wrote: post #23
guerrilla wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if they're jusg English speakers who saw the news and got food poisning (or who knows what)... Why is this such fertile ground for conspiracy theories? Is there some kind of assumption diplomats and spies never get sick with unidentied diseases like the rest of us?

Conspiracy theories are a lot fun when not affecting public behaviour badly(That's why we have huge number of literature and films around conspiracies). Therefore it's intriguing to speculate on a mystery. Oh and these days everyone is an English speaker, at least most diplomats are. Whatever the US ones read, the Spanish, the French, the Italians, the Bulgarians, the Russians, the Brazilians read it too.

> Conspiracy theories are a lot fun when not affecting public behaviour badly(That's why we have huge number of literature and films around conspiracies). Therefore it's intriguing to speculate on a mystery.

This is equivocation. One can enjoy fictional conspiracies without becoming a conspiracy theorist.

> Whatever the US ones read, the Spanish, the French, the Italians, the Bulgarians, the Russians, the Brazilians read it too.

I guess if you've never been to those countries you could think that, but no, even with 39% of French speaking some English, they still mostly read their own news and not American news, unlike Americans.

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#72

Post by seppin »

simonblack wrote: post #26
mrtksn wrote: post #10

So it is happening to US diplomats on two unrelated locations, which indicates that the common element is the US. What if it's as a result of a US spy-craft instrument/substance side effect that potentially was not disclosed to the diplomats who suffer?

Exactly. My take is that these reports are of work-place injuries. Something that the Government employees are doing, or have had done to them, is causing the problems. Examples from the past: Gulf Syndrome in the 1990s caused by anti-gas warfare antidotes, and the Agent Orange cancers and other birth-deformities inflicted on VietNam vets.

Two cases in war zones. How would you explain this happening in a neutral city to civilians?

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#73

Post by boomboomsubban »

chrisseaton wrote: post #62
boomboomsubban wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the news stories exist because people have strange symptoms. Even with no attacks the stories could happen.

Ok... now think this through. Imagine there were no strange symptoms, and so no stories, and you wanted to create the stories... what would you do to cause the symptoms? The attacks, right? Or are you suggesting a foreign power that wanted to cause fear would just hang around and wait and hope for symptoms to appear out of nowhere?

Personally I think that there has never been any foreign power involved in this.

That said, there is the possibility that something happened in Havana and now some foreign power is reaping a long running additional "benefit" without ever attacking again.

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#74

Post by seppin »

mrtksn wrote: post #10

So it is happening to US diplomats on two unrelated locations, which indicates that the common element is the US. What if it's as a result of a US spy-craft instrument/substance side effect that potentially was not disclosed to the diplomats who suffer?

If that was the case, why would they be targeting their own diplomats? Wouldn't it be foreign adversarial diplomats getting sick?

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#75

Post by SCAQTony »

CRConrad wrote: post #63
krona wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From your BMJ reference: The term long covid embraces a wide spectrum of organ involvement, with no clear evidence yet to help inform efficient diagnostic pathways or specific treatments or to indicate probable prognosis.

That still doesn't mean it lacks concrete objectively measurable symptoms.

My mileage varies.

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#76

Post by jhugo »

guerrilla wrote: post #71
mrtksn wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conspiracy theories are a lot fun when not affecting public behaviour badly(That's why we have huge number of literature and films around conspiracies). Therefore it's intriguing to speculate on a mystery. Oh and these days everyone is an English speaker, at least most diplomats are. Whatever the US ones read, the Spanish, the French, the Italians, the Bulgarians, the Russians, the Brazilians read it too.

> Conspiracy theories are a lot fun when not affecting public behaviour badly(That's why we have huge number of literature and films around conspiracies). Therefore it's intriguing to speculate on a mystery. This is equivocation. One can enjoy fictional conspiracies without becoming a conspiracy theorist. > Whatever the US ones read, the Spanish, the French, the Italians, the Bulgarians, the Russians, the Brazilians…

the sentence you quoted refers to diplomats, who likely have a somewhat more international news palate than the average citizen

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#77

Post by jareklupinski »

raylad wrote: post #18

How about issuing every employee with a monitor that detects microwave radiation (since that's what they're saying they think it is)?

similar to how every employee working near nuclear radiation is issued a dosimeter

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#78

Post by mrtksn »

addicted wrote: post #60
mrtksn wrote: post #10

So it is happening to US diplomats on two unrelated locations, which indicates that the common element is the US. What if it's as a result of a US spy-craft instrument/substance side effect that potentially was not disclosed to the diplomats who suffer?

Or it’s a 3rd party targeting the US? The common party being the US doesn’t mean it was caused by the US.

Sure, but who are those people with global reach to US assets and possession of technology that the US cannot understand?

Re: 'Havana syndrome'-like mystery illness affects Vienna US diplomats

#79

Post by guerrilla »

jhugo wrote: post #76
guerrilla wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Conspiracy theories are a lot fun when not affecting public behaviour badly(That's why we have huge number of literature and films around conspiracies). Therefore it's intriguing to speculate on a mystery. This is equivocation. One can enjoy fictional conspiracies without becoming a conspiracy theorist. > Whatever the US ones read, the Spanish, the French, the Italians, the Bulgarians, the Russians, the Brazilians…

the sentence you quoted refers to diplomats, who likely have a somewhat more international news palate than the average citizen

Thanks, I totally skipped over that somehow.
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