Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Building a vision of life without work (2015)

livingafi.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 436 posts

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#71

Post by dcolkitt »

temp8964 wrote: post #30
kevinwang wrote: post #5

This person also posted an amazing, unvarnished update recently (about 5-6 years later): https://livingafi.com/2021/03/17/the-2021-early-retirement-u...

The conclusion came to me is that extreme working and extreme no-working are both bad in the long run. All you need is a work-family-life balance. I am also glad that the author now opens the door for getting married and even having a kid. Work, spouse, kids, the traditional way of life have been explored and chosen by human being for at least thousands of years. The psychological / economic needs for living with a f…

What's interesting is the radical change over the past century, from a life of pure leisure being the mark of the aristocratic upper class to the lumpenproletariat. I love how Downton Abbey conveys this now alien concept to us early on by having the Dowager Countess ask "what is a 'weekend'?". The perfect modern counter-balance is the classic line from Office Space: "Well, you don't need a million dollars to do nothing, man. Take a look at my cousin. He's broke, don't do Shit!"

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#74

Post by alisonatwork »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #7
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #3

This is one of the biggest missing pieces in internet FIRE discussions. So much of the FIRE discourse is about not working that many don’t realize that they’re going to be extremely bored with 16 hours to fill every day. Worse, their friends are all busy with their lives. It’s actually a common failure point of FIRE post-mittens that didn’t work out. Especially with couples, where it’s more likely that at least one p…

Got to admit that watching people struggle with the question of what to do without a job to fill their time is just completely wild to me. It is difficult for me to imagine someone who has so little they want to do outside of work that they can't easily find ways to fill up the 8+ hours a day their job takes from them. I have a list of things I'd like to do a mile long that I know I'll never actually find time to do…

It's truly astonishing how many people apparently have a psychological need to be occupied with work in order to find meaning from their life. I can think of nothing better than to finally never have to worry about working just to cover my rent and food.

Being in tech, I've had the privilege to be able to quit my job every few years and take extended sabbaticals. Without fail those breaks have been the best times of my life. Even when I just spent the time "doing nothing" from the point of view of an outsider - not taking up a new hobby, not working on any personal projects, not operating a side-hustle, just sitting around watching the world go by... it was fine. It was better than fine - it was great. It seems bizarre to me that anyone would prefer structured labor to that kind of freedom, but it turns out some people do.

I just wish we had a society that would allow for both types of people to have the life they want.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#75

Post by kingaillas »

OJFord wrote: post #56
thaumasiotes wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you really find yourself reaching the end of a weekend and thinking Oh thank God I have work tomorrow, I'm so bored? The comment above you is channeling the common need to say anything, no matter what it is, in response to an attack on tradition. This is why people in Oregon hear about a proposal to make pumping your own gas legal and respond "but what if somebody doesn't know how?", as if it were difficult to k…

I realise this is a tangent, but what is 'pumping your own gas'? (And if not clear from that answer, why do people in Oregon specifically object? Not from the US.)

All the gas stations in OR are full-service, that is, an employee of the gas station will fill your gas tank for you.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#76

Post by p1esk »

temp8964 wrote: post #57
p1esk wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Work, spouse, kids, the traditional way of life have been explored and chosen by human being for at least thousands of years. Vast majority of people did not “choose” all that throughout human history. There was zero alternative. They had to work to survive. If you want to make your argument you should only look at those who were born rich enough to not have to work.

Of course people can choose not having spouse or kids. What do you mean there is zero alternative? There are people born rich enough to not have to work, but do they live a happy life by not working all the way?

What do you mean there is zero alternative?

For most of the human history, for vast majority of the people, choosing not to have spouse and kids would mean choosing not to have sex, e.g. to become a monk. Also, the societal pressure to choose a traditional way of life if you were poor was a lot higher.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#77

Post by slumpt_ »

quietbritishjim wrote: post #36
SavantIdiot wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This follow up is way more compelling because it deals with the reality. I'm jealous of the authors communication skills and their partner's: there are some very hard statements in there about feeling worthless and falling behind because of no job. I wonder of those words were spoken calmly, or shouted through tears. Here are their discussions: https://livingafi.com/post-fire-relationship-disconnect/ TL;DR: He has to…

> [article author, to wife] ... I thought that what you wanted was to live a life of freedom, with me. We’d talked about this. > [article author's wife] Not exactly. I wanted to have kids with you and work and be like everyone else. Live a normal life. I’m tired of being weird. And I don’t want to go back to work if you aren’t. That’s weird too. You wouldn’t even be a stay-at-home-dad. You’d be nothing. > [article au…

Yep. Author is avoiding the hardest realizations and emotions here. I don’t necessarily blame them, but they’re gonna need to confront that to have a healthy relationship in the future.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#78

Post by driverdan »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #40
AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Got to admit that watching people struggle with the question of what to do without a job to fill their time is just completely wild to me. It is difficult for me to imagine someone who has so little they want to do outside of work that they can't easily find ways to fill up the 8+ hours a day their job takes from them. I have a list of things I'd like to do a mile long that I know I'll never actually find time to do…

> It is difficult for me to imagine someone who has so little they want to do outside of work that they can't easily find ways to fill up the 8+ hours a day their job takes from them It’s not that simple. I felt the same way before I crossed the FIRE threshold and took some time off (mini-FIRE, I guess). It turns out, most of the things I had been putting off weren’t as time consuming as I thought. I found myself reg…

> It’s not that simple.

It is. I took about 18 months off a few years ago. It was great until I ran out of money.

My main motivator was a very big project (converting a bus to live in) that took a lot of time but after that was done I still did lots of other projects, played video games, and traveled.

In some ways I missed contributing my skills to a team but, other than needing money, I wasn't strongly motivated to go back to work.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#79

Post by throw1234651234 »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #20
kevinwang wrote: post #5

This person also posted an amazing, unvarnished update recently (about 5-6 years later): https://livingafi.com/2021/03/17/the-2021-early-retirement-u...

This follow up is way more compelling because it deals with the reality. I'm jealous of the authors communication skills and their partner's: there are some very hard statements in there about feeling worthless and falling behind because of no job. I wonder of those words were spoken calmly, or shouted through tears. Here are their discussions: https://livingafi.com/post-fire-relationship-disconnect/ TL;DR: He has to…

Always beautiful to see people comment on the realities of these situations.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#80

Post by OJFord »

neogodless wrote: post #66
OJFord wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I realise this is a tangent, but what is 'pumping your own gas'? (And if not clear from that answer, why do people in Oregon specifically object? Not from the US.)

In the United States, most adults outside dense (or well-planned) cities own their own gas (petrol) powered vehicle. In most places, you go to a gas (petrol) station to refill the tank. In some states, it's illegal (for liability reasons) to do this refilling yourself. An attendant has to come around, collect payment, and refill the tank for you.

Oh! I see, thank you. I was thinking if it's something like methane harvesting like the moped art project on the front page, why would that be Oregon-specific, ha.

Here in the UK (we don't call it gas, so that threw me off, and) not 'pumping your own' is unheard of - payment either self serve at the pump (in the last ~15y anyway, since 'chip & PIN' I suppose), or inside.

Post reply on HN