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LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

biorxiv.org

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Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#71

Post by romesmoke »

throwaway64389 wrote: post #24

Anecdata: I once took LSD and went on a bad trip. I "discovered" that everything in the universe is fractal: space, time and causality. Every microsecond of existence contains within itself the whole existence of the universe and at the same time each one of those 'temporal universes' contains other temporal universes, every micrometer contains the whole space, and every moment there are millions of decisions that ta…

>Also, we're all the same person or being. > >Weird day.

Not that weird according to Alan Watts' "Book" AKA "On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are". This is the main tenet, and it can briefly be described as a God who plays hide n' seek with Godself.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#72

Post by fastball »

throwaway64389 wrote: post #24

Anecdata: I once took LSD and went on a bad trip. I "discovered" that everything in the universe is fractal: space, time and causality. Every microsecond of existence contains within itself the whole existence of the universe and at the same time each one of those 'temporal universes' contains other temporal universes, every micrometer contains the whole space, and every moment there are millions of decisions that ta…

Sounds like a fantastic trip.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#73

Post by fastball »

yoloyoloyoloa wrote: post #59

I decided to start a career in programming and IT oneday at 21 on a LSD bad trip from hell. It was really an eye opening trip and just realized this would be the best possible career path to take. I have never looked back since.

How is it a bad trip that set you on a career path you like?

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#74

Post by vkomega »

sammalloy wrote: post #61
vkomega wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great, thanks for the objective response. My inquiry was substantially downvoted. How can one determine if they are at risk of psychosis prior to consuming LSD? I've heard many stories of people who were "never the same" (in a bad life-outcome sense) after having bad LSD trips. It wasn't clear from family history or medical history that they were at-risk for such a reaction. At least based on these outcomes, it might…

> How can one determine if they are at risk of psychosis prior to consuming LSD? Family history of mental illness, particularly schizophrenia. > I've heard many stories of people who were "never the same" (in a bad life-outcome sense) after having bad LSD trips. I think those stories are overblown. People like to have something to blame for when a loved one goes down the wrong path.

> history

This was addressed in my previous comment. I've known folks who took the stuff and had a horrible reaction, without family history as such.

Also, consuming street drugs of unknown quality in uncontrolled settings with uncontrolled dosages is quite different than controlled medical experiments.

> overblown

I never wanted to try the stuff after personally observing people change after having a "bad trip". If it permanently alters perceptions in unpredictable ways, then ingesting it likely catalyzes alternate life trajectories, also in unpredictable ways.

Seems like a double edged sword. Many report the positive benefits but the supporters seem to downplay risks or point to other factors without supporting evidence.

It's unclear how to determine safety with prospective victims/winners whose family history doesn't include mental illness. Again, I suspect dosage is a critical factor to trip outcome; this being common pharmacological wisdom.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#75

Post by andyana »

fastball wrote: post #73
yoloyoloyoloa wrote: post #59

I decided to start a career in programming and IT oneday at 21 on a LSD bad trip from hell. It was really an eye opening trip and just realized this would be the best possible career path to take. I have never looked back since.

How is it a bad trip that set you on a career path you like?

I believe it is possible to have a bad trip in this sense because it typically takes time to integrate the experience. The time spent trying to integrate can be scary, because you don't understand it yet.

I had a vision of a blonde child, perhaps six years old, burst out of a tunnel of light during a DMT trip. I still don't know what it means, and because my son is blonde, i can't help but feel that maybe there is a message im not seeing (this is coming from an ex-atheist of twenty years). It was a weird event, but it has made me make positive changes in my life regardless. For example, I try a lot harder to have the time for him. I've decided to stop trying to date because of it (so that I don't have to divide my time more), and that's given me a self esteem boost.

It is a complex thing, one that we don't understand. Its a beautiful experience, but one I don't take lightly. It needs respect.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#76

Post by tcmb »

gherkinnn wrote: post #69
sammalloy wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find this description quite unsettling because it is so common. More importantly, the description isn't just found in trip reports. It's found throughout history, in reports of people who have had what are called peak experiences, sometimes involving trauma. There are many stories of prisoners in the literature, for example, who come to the realization that both the jailer and the jailed are the same. Jack Kornfi…

> Many people tend to toss these things into religion or spirituality It is a shame that interesting and/or valuable aspects of our lives are held hostage by (what I see as) irritating cults.

I would call spirituality in general the 'mapping' of these spaces, descriptions of the way to get there and navigate them, and the preservation of accounts of people who've visited them.

A religion, as I see it, is already focused on one particular version of the map. This can be fine, for example if the particular path is especially compatible with the rest of the culture that's around it. It starts being problematic once it discredits other versions and accounts. Irritating cults is what it becomes when it gets further warped by ego concerns and misinterpretations.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#78

Post by gerdesj »

throwaway64389 wrote: post #24

Anecdata: I once took LSD and went on a bad trip. I "discovered" that everything in the universe is fractal: space, time and causality. Every microsecond of existence contains within itself the whole existence of the universe and at the same time each one of those 'temporal universes' contains other temporal universes, every micrometer contains the whole space, and every moment there are millions of decisions that ta…

You mention microseconds and micometers. Those are on the scale of the edge of our various human senses.

Now, your quantum thingies happen on the scale of the Planck constant. I've just asked Google what h is and I got this beast:

6.62607004 × 10^-34 m^2 kg / s

Note the mixed suffixes and the silly precision for a web search result. I'm not a mathematician. If I was a physicist or chemist or whatever doing calcs for real, I probably wouldn't use Google to look up the latest result. I'd quote a paper. So 6.63 is more than enough for the number in a search result.

Units: metres squared kilograms per second. The notation for the number is different to the notation for the unit, so we can conclude that Mr Google is a bit slack. The number is given with negative exponent notation and the units with slash notation.

OK, so Google is a bit crap.

Back to my thesis: Your trippy self needs to really get to grips with the fabric of reality. That fabric is far more fantastic and granular than you have experienced so far on LSD.

You carved things up into 10^-3 (micro) when you stuffed some pretty funky drugs into your bloodstream. Mr Planck has shown that you need to worry about 10^-34 if you are going to really get to grips with the fabric of reality. You'll need quite a large lab and some decent funding .... or a bit more imagination.

Good luck.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#79

Post by gremlinsinc »

throwaway64389 wrote: post #24

Anecdata: I once took LSD and went on a bad trip. I "discovered" that everything in the universe is fractal: space, time and causality. Every microsecond of existence contains within itself the whole existence of the universe and at the same time each one of those 'temporal universes' contains other temporal universes, every micrometer contains the whole space, and every moment there are millions of decisions that ta…

I've noticed ... changes to existing facts in reality that shouldn't change. No, it wasn't bad memory. I have a bad memory, but when it's something I'm hyper (adhd) obsessively focused on, and then it changes within 3 days, that is different than a mis-remembered childhood spelling like Berenstein/Berenstain Bears.

I'm agnostic (exmormon), I think God(s) are narcissistic man-king-modeled control structures. However after experience reality shift -- all without any drug use... I've become somewhat "spiritual" in a sense, in that I feel there's a lot more to everything than I ever imagined.

Simulation theory is my strongest belief, but secondary would be entropic multiverses colliding when they have no more room to split into new universes.

Scientifically, I find the Cosmological Axis of Evil quite odd that it puts our solar system somehow "central" to the universe (on one axis), from a simulation perspective you could argue the simulation renders what's needed and started here on out.

Anyhow, i've been going down rabbit holes on "occult" wisdom trying to see if there's a way to actually change reality by one's accord. So far dead ends (or I haven't gone far enough yet to reach "enlightenment"), most promising idea is meditation (silencing brain completely) might open some "conduit" to learn from the universe or make changes, or both.

Looking at toltec (/r/castaneda), spiritual subs, buddhist, hindu, etc... that's the one common thread: quiet the mind. Learn to meditate. Lucid dreams may help. Astral Projections could help. I guess in other words train your brain to find some of the same things LSD brings organically without the need for drugs. Probably healthier that way, but it's a long process.

There is a big benefit though in working on meditation practices: anxiety goes way down. That's nice after last year. I've had panic attacks, etc. So, I guess if I figure shit out or not, there's at least a benefit for trying.

Re: LSD and psilocybin increase the fractal dimension of brain activity

#80

Post by gremlinsinc »

sammalloy wrote: post #41
thebas wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this description quite unsettling because it is so common. I experienced it myself after trying magic mushroom: We are all one being(we call it the universe), it's consciousness subdivided between us all in order to escape it's solitude. It was scary at the time believing this sad possibility. I'm not so sure but the thought remains. Also follows: whatever you do to me you will be experiencing it.

> I find this description quite unsettling because it is so common. More importantly, the description isn't just found in trip reports. It's found throughout history, in reports of people who have had what are called peak experiences, sometimes involving trauma. There are many stories of prisoners in the literature, for example, who come to the realization that both the jailer and the jailed are the same. Jack Kornfi…

I'm an atheist (post-mormon) but I do consider it "spiritual" but I hate religion, so I don't group it in there, but I've been having some sort of "awakening" ... I'm not fully atheist though I guess, I could sign on to us all being one consciousness re-living until we experience them all, or just multiple consciousnesses that somehow floated through space and got attached to this earth...

Something something... I can buy an afterlife, just don't buy there's a God, at least not one like any worshiped on earth, they all resemble kings too closely, and are too narcissistic. Enki might be the only exception, he was a scientist - stood up for man, gave us knowledge, but basically is as most scientists humble and could give a rats ass about being worshipped, considers us just the discovery channel. Keyword: Aloof.

Of course, that's just a myth. Still, my favorite mythological character. Anyhow, tangent aside my point - is no God, no need to worship. however if we're all each other, and we are the universe, or part of it and it's all different layers of conscious "agents" as Donald Hoffman calls it, then I think maybe a religion based on that could at least encourage fairness. One tenet : All are one, treat all as you would yourself regardless of race, nationality, religion, sexual orientation, etc.

Honestly, I see that as the penultimate human utopian ideal, but I think as long as we give elitism roots, we'll never get there, there's no room for elitism in a world where all are equal.

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