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Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

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Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#71
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't use bitcoin but one attraction I see is that it lets you spend your money without anyone else's permission. If you buy something with it, the seller gets the money without your having to worry about automated fraud checks causing your credit card to be declined, check to be put on hold, etc. It's like cash that way. Wire transfers might be an alternative, but they are only practical for fairly large transacti…

Every bitcoin transaction happening online today is brokered by the same payments processors who decide that your credit card is committing fraud.

Not if you directly transfer bitcoin to the destination wallet address, without going through a broker or payment processor.

This isn't possible with credit card or bank transfers.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#73
post #42
post #38

The explanation I have seen works best for a non-technical audience is – Bitcoin is digital gold, and there is a global ledger which automatically tracks who owns how much of it. There is a finite amount of it out there, and it has to be "mined". There is nothing that makes it different from any other "coin" or really any other combination of bits (just like gold isn't unique among all the elements in any way), but i…

> No country or central government decides how much gold is worth This is true today. It was not true in the US 50 years ago. It does not need to be true tomorrow. The government can put ceilings and floors in the price of all things just as easily as Turkey banned crypto.

> The government can put ceilings and floors in the price of all things

and see how Venezuela fared when they tried to control their official currency exchange to the USD.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#74

I don't know why there's an article that makes the rounds once a month analogizing bitcoin to some other thing when.. 1 bitcoin is its own thing 2 bitcoin has a clear analog in the form of gold Collectibles are a terrible analogy because 1 they are not fungable and bitcoin is 2 they are not easily converted into currency whereas bitcoin is 3 they carry novelty and bitcoin does not (cryptocurrency may carry some novel…

> bitcoin does not have the track record that gold does.

That's a heck of an understatement - Gold's track record dates back essentially to the beginning of civilization or earlier.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#75

As a casual observer I see the cryptocurrency space only seriously used by two groups of people: those who want to buy goods/services which are controlled in their or the seller's jurisdiction and so need a bit more anonymity than Paypal; and people who run ICO and more recently NFT swindles. I have yet to see a widespread other usage of cryptocurrency.

Finance is slowly moving in to get a share of the pie. Meaning: making money somehow.

See: Derivative based on bitcoin/ETH.

It's not a counterpoint, just a third category.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If everyone suddenly switched to believing “Oh bitcoin doesn’t do anything but it is a fun collectible which also has mining costs to track ownership” its value would plummet. That's generally true for all currencies. If everyone suddenly switched to believing "X-sovereign-currency" doesn't do anything but legitimizes that sovereign and has military and human rights costs to maintain the illusion of that legitimacy…

> their value is in your head, or at the tip of the gun, or because you can pay taxes in it or get sent to jail. These all seem very real. And not something that will disappear (or even drop) if media attention or nerd interest moves elsewhere.

We had other global reserve currencies before USD and they have all lost their reserve status, it can and will happen to USD too, as other countries become more powerful.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#77

This article is knocking down a squadron of strawmen. First off, bitcoins key attribute is not “privacy” but censorship resistance. It’s why wikileaks has been able to keep operating all these years after being cancelled by the mainstream payments industry. Not to mention many smaller, politically oppressed activist organizations, and much of the marijuana industry. Secondly, the attributes of money are, according to…

Inequality comes from power, and fiat inflation where power determines who gets the newly printed money is just one form of that. Inequality existed back when money was hard, and it will continue to exist even if another form of digital hard money replaces it. Money is a form of social organization of humans and an information system, and you always have to remember the humans is what keeps the entire thing running.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#78

I don't know why there's an article that makes the rounds once a month analogizing bitcoin to some other thing when.. 1 bitcoin is its own thing 2 bitcoin has a clear analog in the form of gold Collectibles are a terrible analogy because 1 they are not fungable and bitcoin is 2 they are not easily converted into currency whereas bitcoin is 3 they carry novelty and bitcoin does not (cryptocurrency may carry some novel…

> they are not fungable and bitcoin is

Bitcoin is not fungible. Bitcoins can be distinguished by their transaction history. Governments are blacklisting addresses and all bitcoins that have passed through them are now tainted. Exchanges already reject deposits containing coins tainted by association with blacklisted individuals or even coin mixing services.

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#79

I don't know why there's an article that makes the rounds once a month analogizing bitcoin to some other thing when.. 1 bitcoin is its own thing 2 bitcoin has a clear analog in the form of gold Collectibles are a terrible analogy because 1 they are not fungable and bitcoin is 2 they are not easily converted into currency whereas bitcoin is 3 they carry novelty and bitcoin does not (cryptocurrency may carry some novel…

I'm not an expert but I keep reading that bitcoin isn't fungible. Each bitcoin has a unique ID and public provenance, and that there are other coins that are truly fungible, like Monero - am I way off the mark?

Re: Bitcoin has few attributes of money but all the attributes of a collectible

#80
post #52
post #7

The funny thing is that Bitcoin will basically only have value as a collectible as long as substantial numbers of people believe this essay’s argument is false . People want to collect bitcoin at current valuations because they are convinced it will become a currency/store of value of the future and hence rise in value. If everyone suddenly switched to believing “Oh bitcoin doesn’t do anything but it is a fun collect…

Here's a question: how many people do you know that buy crypto intend to spend it? You know, use it like currency? Or are they all just HODLing in the hopes that some other buyer will come along who believes it will become a medium of exchange? In my view, it's not a currency until people stop speculating and start using it like a currency. So yes, it's a collectible with ridiculously high transaction costs that make…

It has value as a currency on dark markets and possibly for companies paying hackers off to disable ransomware. I can't really think of why people would use it instead of fiat for something like a Tesla though.
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