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For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

timesofisrael.com

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Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#71

Post by elliekelly »

mkoubaa wrote: post #40
imagine99 wrote: post #13

Well, regardless of the topic at hand (the point about brain-size shrinking when eating plants certainly sounds interesting), already the infographics are full of obvious typos ("Domesticsted", "Larg prey") which suggests shoddy editing at least. While that made me chuckle a bit in the context of "brain size" it also leads me to not giving to much credence to the quality of the rest of the text (which I cannot really…

I didn't see brain size linked directly to diet here, only saw it on the infographic. In another study recently, I saw brain size linked to the challenge of hunting large animals (like cave bears and mammoths)

That’s interesting because I’ve also read that animal brain size is positively correlated with group communication and social network size. In order for early humans to successfully hunt large animals, especially large predators, I would imagine it would take quite a lot of group communication and coordination.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#72

Post by amanaplanacanal »

nish1500 wrote: post #16
Google234 wrote: post #4

This must be devastating news to the vegans and vegetarians they insist that meat is not natural.

Stone age humans are hardly the standard we should be aspiring for. The biggest two arguments for veganism are: 1. The horrific practises of the animal agriculture industry, which looks nothing like a chiseled hunter holding a bow 2. The devastating impact of the above on the environment Cavemen had neither of these issues.

We wouldn’t have those issues either if we would just stop having so many babies.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#73

Post by CynicusRex »

danr4 wrote: post #17

In 2019, age 30, I ate only red meat (and a little fish) for about 8 months. It was by far the peak of my physical condition. Better sleep, stronger workouts, no mid-day grogginess. Blood test results were as best as one could hope for, apart for the debatable "high cholesterol". Unfortunately a couple of trips abroad (damn Italy) and I got back to a more standard diet. Have put on 15kg since. I've been longing to re…

And I know of two people (bitcoin evangelists, lol) who had explosive diarrhea or an impacted bowel on a meat only diet, and had to be hospitalized.

Whereas my athletic performance on a vegan diet has never been better as well.

What to make of this? The body can adapt quite nicely to many foodstuffs as long as you do proper research on what foods to eat so you get all the nutrients you need. Not eating fruit and vegetables just seems folly to me.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#74

Post by Al-Khwarizmi »

danr4 wrote: post #17

In 2019, age 30, I ate only red meat (and a little fish) for about 8 months. It was by far the peak of my physical condition. Better sleep, stronger workouts, no mid-day grogginess. Blood test results were as best as one could hope for, apart for the debatable "high cholesterol". Unfortunately a couple of trips abroad (damn Italy) and I got back to a more standard diet. Have put on 15kg since. I've been longing to re…

I had a similar experience, but with lots of noodles. I spent some months living in Singapore and I ate a lot of noodle and rice (but especially noodle) dishes almost every day, at lunch and dinner, because there are plenty of good ones there and I just can't get enough of them. I lost weight, slept better than normal (in spite of the commonly held claim that pasta at night is terrible for sleep), had less gas, felt better in general; in spite of not doing more physical activity than normal. Periods of more meat didn't work so well for me, though.

My experience doesn't fit well with the now popular position that pasta is the devil. And it's also different from yours. My conclusion is that people's bodies are different. What works for one person may not work for another, and probably that's a big part of the reason why it seems to be so hard for experts to agree on what we should eat.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#75

Post by albertgoeswoof »

sto_hristo wrote: post #66
JPKab wrote: post #19

My father had a mid-life crisis in the mid 90's, and went from being an avid hunter and fisherman to being a hardcore animal rights vegan. (It was all precipitated by him meeting and dating a woman who worked at PETA) He was about 45 at the time. Within 2 years, his health had markedly declined. There are healthy vegan diets, but his was an unhealthy vegan diet. Despite no history of heart attacks on either his mothe…

Went in a peanuts store to get... well... peanuts. They have all sorts of *nuts. Before me a customer was talking to the seller about stuff. The seller offers him to try an almond coated with chocolate and cinnamon, which according to him is the best thing in the store. The customer asks if the chocolate has milk in it. Because, God forbid, he can't have anything animal related, cuz he's vegan. He wouldn't even touch…

Vegans don’t eat animal produce- including cow’s milk. Why would you expect a vegan to eat milk chocolate?

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#76

Post by raffraffraff »

JPKab wrote: post #19

My father had a mid-life crisis in the mid 90's, and went from being an avid hunter and fisherman to being a hardcore animal rights vegan. (It was all precipitated by him meeting and dating a woman who worked at PETA) He was about 45 at the time. Within 2 years, his health had markedly declined. There are healthy vegan diets, but his was an unhealthy vegan diet. Despite no history of heart attacks on either his mothe…

I've been vegetarian for 25 years. I'm male, 45 years old, my resting heart rate is around 50, and I can run 10km in under 50 minutes (and I do this about 3 times per week).

Scroll back 5 years. My wife and I decided to become vegan (for various reasons - carbon footprint, animal welfare, all that jazz). Having been healthy vegetarians for about 20 years, it should have been easy, but regardless, we were meticulous. In fact, not being the "religious" type, and having found out that bi-valves (oysters, clams, scallops etc) don't have the where-with-all to feel pain, I added them to my diet. We just cut out all eggs and dairy.

Now, I can't swear that going vegan caused my health problems, but about a year after going vegan, my overall "vitality" had dropped (I felt tired, but kept up frequent exercise). But the biggest issue was that I couldn't shake off a cold. It would start with the usual sniffle, and within a few days I have a temperature and my lungs would be infected. I went through about a year of constant on-and-off infections. At the worst point, I had two straight months of infection, seemed to shake off for a few weeks, and got it back again for another two months. I was miserable. I was worried it was something really bad like lung cancer. The doctor prescribed me two types of inhaler, lots of antibiotics and told me I had adult onset asthma.

The inhalers helped me manage things, but I really just felt like I was keeping another infection at bay all the time. I went back on eggs and a small amount of dairy. A few months later I was back running. I haven't had a single problem since. 5 years without inhalers.

I have no idea what really caused my issues. My wife developed an intolerance to soy during our veganism. If she eats tofu for a few days, her skin gets itchy and she eventually get a flare up of rosacea (which btw, she had for months until she figured out the soy connection, but it took weeks after cutting out soy and taking meds before it completely cleared up).

The biggest issue I have with a pure vegan diet isn't just cutting out foods, it's the addition of huge amounts of stuff that you normally wouldn't eat in such high amounts (nut milk, nut butter, nut cheese, nut burgers... soy in everything)

I have encountered these militant vegans too. I don't get into arguments, I just say "it's not for me".

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#77

Post by JoeAltmaier »

albertgoeswoof wrote: post #75
sto_hristo wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Went in a peanuts store to get... well... peanuts. They have all sorts of *nuts. Before me a customer was talking to the seller about stuff. The seller offers him to try an almond coated with chocolate and cinnamon, which according to him is the best thing in the store. The customer asks if the chocolate has milk in it. Because, God forbid, he can't have anything animal related, cuz he's vegan. He wouldn't even touch…

Vegans don’t eat animal produce- including cow’s milk. Why would you expect a vegan to eat milk chocolate?

There are every kind of vegan. No broad generalities cover everybody. That's how.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#78

Post by TheSmiddy »

sto_hristo wrote: post #66
JPKab wrote: post #19

My father had a mid-life crisis in the mid 90's, and went from being an avid hunter and fisherman to being a hardcore animal rights vegan. (It was all precipitated by him meeting and dating a woman who worked at PETA) He was about 45 at the time. Within 2 years, his health had markedly declined. There are healthy vegan diets, but his was an unhealthy vegan diet. Despite no history of heart attacks on either his mothe…

Went in a peanuts store to get... well... peanuts. They have all sorts of *nuts. Before me a customer was talking to the seller about stuff. The seller offers him to try an almond coated with chocolate and cinnamon, which according to him is the best thing in the store. The customer asks if the chocolate has milk in it. Because, God forbid, he can't have anything animal related, cuz he's vegan. He wouldn't even touch…

What you are describing is not a fanatic. You are describing someone adhering to the basic tenants of their philosophy. A vegan fanatic would refuse to use cash in Australia because it contains tallow, an animal product used as a slipping agent in banknotes.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#79

Post by m000 »

1experience wrote: post #41

Good example of media selection bias here, notice how this study is completely ignored by mainstream media: https://imgur.com/a/lkaoClD if it had said "Humans ate vegetables and little else" it would be on r/all now.

There is a media bias here, but it's not what you're implying. It is Israeli media picking up a story promoted by Israeli scientists. This is common practice for media in EMEA countries.

But most importantly, you're overlooking the authors' bias. 1st/last authors seem to be making an academic career on proving that humans are carnivores. 2nd author is a self-confessed fan of low-carb diets, and listed as the founder of a company offering a nutrition tracker based on the same principles.

Not exactly an unbiased trio. And without the hinges of peer-review that would stop them from making wide claims, I would skip the news article altogether.

And not being unbiased is probably why you won't see their research on international media, that would arguably be a bit more picky, having a wider selection of science stories to choose from.

Re: For 2M years, humans ate meat and little else: study

#80

Post by microtherion »

femiagbabiaka wrote: post #9

Link to the actual study: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ajpa.24247

There seem to be some rather dubious assumptions there, notably that hunting is a more efficient way of acquiring nutrition than gathering. I'm not a specialist in the field, but my understanding was the opposite.

And sentences such as "[...] baboons [...] devote almost all their daylight hours to feeding [...] while adult Ache and Hadza men spend only a third of the day in food acquisition, preparation, and feeding"? I probably wouldn't go there…

It's kind of convenient that one of the author appears to be selling an app that has just the right diet for the modern troglodyte: https://nutrita.app/author/raphael-sirtoli/

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