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AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

thefastertimes.com

71–80 of 124 posts

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#71

This just makes me think: why in the world would any one want to become a writer these days? There isn't much money in it, unless you get lucky and hit it big. I understanding having a passion, but this is one passion that should be relegated to hobby time. Am I wrong on this? I'm just not seeing the economic viability of writing sentences and having people (whether readers or advertisers) paying you proportionate to…

Meeting and talking earnestly with lots of people, being out in the field chasing something, the thrill of knowing first..

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who runs a application design and development business I have yet to receive or sign a contract that doesn't explicitly state the final disposition for the rights to the resulting IP. I would find it hard to believe that there's a publishing outlet that doesn't do the same in their contractor agreements, particularly with writers.

Code is patentable, but articles are not. What type of language do you use in your contracts to enforce this?

Code is patentable, but articles are not

No actually code, on its own is not patentable, systems and algorithms are. All those cool Apache and BSD licenses are about copyright which apply equally to code and a news article.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#73
post #67
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HackerNews :)

Well Hacker News doesn't make any revenue and acts as a community project of a company, not a profit-aiming brand.

It also produces 0 content, merely comments.

It's an aggregator.

We've all got used to the aggregators like google making all the money by convincing everyone content should be free. It was the greatest and long-term wise worst achievement of the dot com boom.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#74

There's nothing unique to AOL here. When I first got out of college, I interviewed at local newspapers up and down the east coast. Entry level jobs had awful pay, about $15K/yr, but it was a chance to break in to the business. One grizzled editor chain smoked cigarettes through our interview (you could do that in the office back then). He listened to me describe why I wanted to write. Then he leaned back, blew a clou…

Not just local papers. I worked for The (London) Times on a student scholarship back in the mid-90s. I heard editors telling senior journalists to lie about anti-government movements, and asked to phone up a sister 'paper and lie about calling from another news organisation to find out whether a story was going to be run that weekend. They offered me a job, but I turned it down. I'd had enough being a machine to gene…

Well, I guess they can't all be Robert Fisk.

I get the impression that it's rather a lot like rock stardom, a lot of wanabees, with a few receiving all the pay/accolades.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#75

Maybe this is an idealistic thought, but I think this trend of writing SEO laden garbage is what will finally make quality journalism behind paywalls work. People will eventually be driven to pay for decent content, unable to put up with irrelevant half baked articles churned out at breakneck pace.

I kinda doubt it, in the end google can always do what they did with wikipedia and add a fudge factor (quality news site? +100 google points!).

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#76

Creating content online is NOT a viable business model. Recent history is littered with new content creators, and they've failed. The viable business model is either to host other content - YouTube, Hulu, Pandora, GrooveShark, Earbits, etc - Or to create content that is agnostic as to their use - Hollywood Studios, NY Publishers, Music Labels. - So either AOL should transition to a creator, or transition to a online…

I worked for a content site that ultimately failed. We tried to do high quality content. Even paying writers a decent wage. Ultimately it devolved into what you read here, chasing PVs with provocative and borderline false headlines. Quality takes a back seat as soon as you realize you're bleeding money. It was really sad to see and became a soul-crushing environment. Very very tough business.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#77
post #3

"AOL paid us as “independent contractors," AOL is treading a fine, fine line there. The IRS defines an independent contractor as: "The general rule is that an individual is an independent contractor if the payer has the right to control or direct only the result of the work and not what will be done and how it will be done." This is a notoriously ambiguous definition but with AOL's rigorous guidelines, deadlines, and…

That is not the only criteria. See this comment: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2666507 The other issue is, as a contractor, the contractor retains all copyrights to the material created. Work for hire does not apply in this instance. He could send a DMCA takedown notice and have all of his articles removed, or organize all the other unemployed writers and coordinate a massive DMCA takedown letter writing campai…

Virtually all contractors in our field work under "work-for-hire" clauses. I am baffled by the people voting you up and those questioning you down. It is not "in the Constitution" that two parties can't agree to a binding contract that transfers ownership of work product.

The IRS tests for contractor vs. employee status break down to:

* Does the worker control the "how" as well as the "what" of their task, or do they have to e.g. work at proscribed locations during set hours?

* Does the worker control the business aspects of their work, for instance the cost of tools, the expenses incurred, &c.

* Has the company employing the worker done things to create a de facto employee relationship, such as offering benefits?

None of these are bright-line differences. Contractors routinely work on-site, 9-5, using tools provided by their employers; however, care has been taken in structuring the relationship (for instance, by working corp-to-corp with a large consulting firm or head shop that itself maintains a W2 relationship with the workers).

It is indeed possible or even likely that AOL is treading a fine line by 1099'ing the people writing its content. On the other hand, AOL can afford pretty good lawyers, and it's equally likely that every aspect of their workflow has been structured to avoid imputing employee status to people doing piecework writing for them. You should tone down your stridency. There are a lot of people on HN that consult professionally.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You usually sign agreements before starting contract work for those companies right? I assume they cover it in there. Still I wonder what would happen if an AOL writer sued AOL for copyright infringement citing his/her constitutional rights.

The issue is that the agreement may not be valid because of the business relationship between the two entities. A "work made for hire" is anything an employee makes in the scope of his or her employment OR as a contractor "...a work specially ordered or commissioned for use as a contribution to a collective work, as a part of a motion picture or other audiovisual work, as a translation, as a supplementary work, as a…

If you sign a professionally drafted contract stating that you are being compensated for writing done on a work-for-hire basis, you are not keeping the copyright to your work regardless of whether the IRS determines that your employer owes penalties and interest for stiffing them on your payroll taxes.

Re: AOL Exposed: A Former AOL Employee Speaks Out

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be double-awesome if he submitted under the pseudonym "Chane Markov".

I think "Markoff Chainey" might be more suitable :-)

Or perhaps Mark V Shaney?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_V_Shaney

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