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Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

reuters.com

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Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#71

Post by yokaze »

Nursie wrote: post #20
giantandroids wrote: post #8

You do have to wonder if some of this is politically driven. Germany are losing hundreds of life's a day, while in the meantime the UK has administrated 23 million doses (not sure the ratio of those that were AstraZeneca) and not recorded a single fatality or adverse reaction and are seeing infection rates / deaths drop. I can understand caution under normal circumstances, but nothing is normal right now.

I'm not sure at this point. When it was one suspicious death, countries suspending the vaccine definitely seemed like an overreaction, and unfortunately this particular vaccine has been something of a political football and subject of a lot of noise. But as more blood-clot deaths emerge... you gotta think caution is wise. OTOH yes, we in the UK have administered a lot of this stuff, and you'd think someone would have…

> But as more blood-clot deaths emerge... you gotta think caution is wise.

I would challenge the term "caution", as it implies giving the vaccine is more risky than not.

> Difficult to call, but I hope it's all being investigated thoroughly

I agree there. But rather not for medical reasons.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#72

Post by corndoge »

scotty79 wrote: post #45
corndoge wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that obvious? If you have the choice between self quarantining and trying to avoid contracting a virus that, if contracted, has a low percentage of killing you, vs choosing to get a vaccine that also has a low percentage of killing you, why would you choose the vaccine?

Because one "low" is few orders of magnitude lower than other "low".

Right, but that's assuming you get the virus; to properly compare it you have to factor the chance you contract the virus in the first place. I'm not saying the math works out better, I haven't done it myself, but I'd bet most people would choose to try to avoid contracting

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#74

Post by Barrin92 »

dcolkitt wrote: post #21
giantandroids wrote: post #8

You do have to wonder if some of this is politically driven. Germany are losing hundreds of life's a day, while in the meantime the UK has administrated 23 million doses (not sure the ratio of those that were AstraZeneca) and not recorded a single fatality or adverse reaction and are seeing infection rates / deaths drop. I can understand caution under normal circumstances, but nothing is normal right now.

Well, you see fifty years a few thousand birth defects occurred because one drug was approved too fast. Therefore millions now have to needlessly die while perfectly good vaccines go stale.

this is awful first order thinking. If public authorities are perceived as untrustworthy on the safety of vaccines, there's a very high chance there will be widespread rejection of vaccination altogether in the population.

People aren't utilitarian machines, trust in drugs is very easily broken, vaccines in particular. Showing neglect and lack of precaution may harm vaccination efforts for decades.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#75

Post by totalZero »

onetimemanytime wrote: post #27
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #9

The pandemic has made me believe we need to be greater consiquentalists in our polices. It's pretty obvious that on the whole the AstraZeneca vax will save more people than are killed from the side effects. We don't not live in a 0 risk existence.

Ummmm....we can wait and get another vaccine? The vaccine is done on HEALTHY people, we're not talking about meds on terminal stage cancer patients with nothing to lose.

You can also just expose yourself to the virus and build immunity that way. Up to you.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#76

Post by johnnycerberus »

jansan wrote: post #37

How many countries have stopped AZ fo far? - Denmark - Norway - Ireland - Netherlands - Iceland - Bulgaria - Romania (only partly, see child comment) Am I missing any?

Romania did not stop the vaccination. It is ongoing. Only the faulty ones (as believed from the intel/reports we got from Italy and Netherlands) were eliminated from the pool.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#77

Post by DrBazza »

s_dev wrote: post #22
giantandroids wrote: post #8

You do have to wonder if some of this is politically driven. Germany are losing hundreds of life's a day, while in the meantime the UK has administrated 23 million doses (not sure the ratio of those that were AstraZeneca) and not recorded a single fatality or adverse reaction and are seeing infection rates / deaths drop. I can understand caution under normal circumstances, but nothing is normal right now.

It's entirely possible a facility is producing vaccine that isn't up to QA standards i.e. a bad batch. The Irish reasoning for suspending AZ wasn't just because of blood clots but blood clots in the brain which have a completley different severity.

> In terms of quality, there are also no confirmed issues related to any batch of our vaccine used across Europe, or the rest of the world.

https://www.astrazeneca.com/media-centre/press-releases/2021...

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#78

Post by corndoge »

dcolkitt wrote: post #35
corndoge wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that obvious? If you have the choice between self quarantining and trying to avoid contracting a virus that, if contracted, has a low percentage of killing you, vs choosing to get a vaccine that also has a low percentage of killing you, why would you choose the vaccine?

This is like saying you should never leave your house, because you could die in a car accident. (And the chance of dying from the AZ vaccine is at most the chance of dying driving to vaccination site.)

No, it's not like saying that

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#79

Post by the-dude »

The EU commission has framed AZ as not trustworthy from the moment the first delivery targets could not be met.

This has influenced public opinion in NL quite a bit ( in DE too I suspect ). I can read in the local comment sections that people want to decline the AZ vaccine as they don't trust it, and it is only 60% effective. They would rather have Pfizer, even Sputnik or rather no vacination at all than AZ. These commenters seem quite hostile to AZ and the UK for that matter.

And these comments are from before the clotting allegations.

This is and has been quite a contra-productive negotiation strategy from the EU commission, directly endangering public health in my humbe opinion.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#80

Post by sjwest »

giantandroids wrote: post #8

You do have to wonder if some of this is politically driven. Germany are losing hundreds of life's a day, while in the meantime the UK has administrated 23 million doses (not sure the ratio of those that were AstraZeneca) and not recorded a single fatality or adverse reaction and are seeing infection rates / deaths drop. I can understand caution under normal circumstances, but nothing is normal right now.

Its unfortunate they felt the need to stop the administration of this vaccine, as this will only further slow down vaccine distribution in Germany/Europe. I think you've got it spot on there - it stinks of politically motivated attack, but I'm not clear how this could benefit Germany's politicians slowing down the administration of the vaccine? Maybe they can use this as an excuse for the poor administration rates???

BTW I literally just had the Astra Zenica vaccine here in UK - I have a sore arm, lets hope I don't get any of the reported side effects!

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