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Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

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Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#71

Post by folli »

manigandham wrote: post #11

Similar to the recent actions by Twitter, Google, Apple and Amazon; Visa and Mastercard are private companies and can do whatever they want. Anyone who has an issue with what Visa/MC did must also take issue with the others.

I'm getting slightly fatigued with this point of view ("X is a private company and can do what it wants").

If a company reaches a certain size and has a quasi-monopolistic position so that other people or companies depend on it, it starts to have some degree of responsibility towards society that's beyond value maximization for shareholders.

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#72

Post by Daho0n »

emteycz wrote: post #44
ravenstine wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well that and the labor protections we do provide end up primarily benefiting businesses and unions over the individual workers themselves.

Same here in Europe. I don't believe it's possible to have unions (or governments) that work for the individual.

Definitely not the same "in Europe". Maybe in some of it (after all the two biggest countries in Europe is Russia and Ukraine). In Scandinavia unions work really well for the most part - at least extremely well compared to the US. It is one of the biggest reasons for the Scandinavian model.

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#73

Post by mst »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #4

How do you ensure that the person performing sex work is being compensated for sex work, versus some form of exploitation (whether that's the platform or an individual exploiting)? A sex worker union [1] who can negotiate with distribution companies and platforms, lobby legislators and payment facilitators (who should not be prohibiting payments for legal business transactions), and ensure quality working conditions…

This is an important question in terms of all work.

But even without being able to answer it, restricting sex workers' choices via deplatforming and criminalisation invariably makes them less safe, so I'd argue that we should stop doing that anyway.

Letting them actually report exploitation to the police would be a start (and no, swedish model bullshit doesn't achieve that, if you criminalise any part of the transaction they realistically can't take full advantage of the existing protections under law).

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#74

Post by tidepod12 »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #46
manigandham wrote: post #11

Similar to the recent actions by Twitter, Google, Apple and Amazon; Visa and Mastercard are private companies and can do whatever they want. Anyone who has an issue with what Visa/MC did must also take issue with the others.

I'm willing to revise my take on the "big tech takedown" when someone explains to me how a random member of the American public can pay a pornographic performer/model without using Visa/Mastercard and in less than 24 hours. If there were no alternatives to Twitter, Android, iOS and AWS then I'd be as unhappy about that as I am about Visa/Mastercard's decision here. However, it's my judgement that there are alternativ…

Then the pornographic performers should just make their own payment network, no?

That's what everyone's been telling Parler since they started being removed from these platforms.

I also don't know how you can reconcile this comment with the fact that Gab and others were removed from Visa/MC networks, to much fanfare.

To be clear, I'm in favor of Parler going away, but I can't help but notice the double standards.

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#75

Post by manigandham »

slg wrote: post #67
manigandham wrote: post #11

Similar to the recent actions by Twitter, Google, Apple and Amazon; Visa and Mastercard are private companies and can do whatever they want. Anyone who has an issue with what Visa/MC did must also take issue with the others.

This is a bizarre comment. The complaint isn't that Pornhub, Visa, or Mastercard lack the right to do what they are doing. People are explaining reasons why it is a bad decision and those reasons aren't relevant to Twitter, Google, Apple, and Amazon. There is nothing contradictory about someone who believes these companies have the right to kick people off their platform while also thinking that these companies can m…

The point is that if you have an issue with companies taking private action over state prosecution then that should apply to all decisions.

Whether you consider an individual decision to be a mistake is entirely subjective and irrelevant.

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#76

Post by thaumasiotes »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #60
noitsnot wrote: post #16

Moody doesn’t seem to care about the abuse or victims that is rampant in the industry, she just wants to get paid.

Not getting paid for your work is a form of abuse. None of us can solve all the world's ills and most of us focus on things that hit close to home. Think of all the foundations that have been created because some wealthy celebrity (or a relative of theirs) had a particular medical condition. Michael J. Fox Foundation for Parkinson's Research https://www.michaeljfox.org/ Christopher and Dana Reeve Foundation https://w…

> Think of all the foundations that have been created because some wealthy celebrity (or a relative of theirs) had a particular medical condition.

> Michael J. Fox Foundation for Parkinson's Research

This is a tangent, but I remember a minor news item of Michael J. Fox appearing in an ad soliciting donations for Parkinson's research, Rush Limbaugh (maybe?) criticizing him for "exaggerating his symptoms" in the ad, and then Jon Stewart (definitely) lambasting the criticism on the Daily Show, something along the lines of "How DARE Michael J. Fox appear in an ad trying to fund research into the crippling disease that Michael J. Fox has?!?"

I've been trying to find a clip of that, if anyone knows where to look?

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#77

Post by [deleted] »

folli wrote: post #71
manigandham wrote: post #11

Similar to the recent actions by Twitter, Google, Apple and Amazon; Visa and Mastercard are private companies and can do whatever they want. Anyone who has an issue with what Visa/MC did must also take issue with the others.

I'm getting slightly fatigued with this point of view ("X is a private company and can do what it wants"). If a company reaches a certain size and has a quasi-monopolistic position so that other people or companies depend on it, it starts to have some degree of responsibility towards society that's beyond value maximization for shareholders.

[deleted]

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#78

Post by emteycz »

Daho0n wrote: post #72
emteycz wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here in Europe. I don't believe it's possible to have unions (or governments) that work for the individual.

Definitely not the same "in Europe". Maybe in some of it (after all the two biggest countries in Europe is Russia and Ukraine). In Scandinavia unions work really well for the most part - at least extremely well compared to the US. It is one of the biggest reasons for the Scandinavian model.

I'd say "most of it", you're right that there are two countries where it seems to work at least a little - at great costs though, I have many Scandinavian colleagues (working in hi-tech fields) that left their country because of overregulation.

Re: Sex workers say 'defunding Pornhub' puts their livelihoods at risk

#79

Post by adrian_b »

leetcrew wrote: post #64
occamrazor wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android/iOS is a duopoly as pervasive as Visa/MasterCard. The ither examples only to a much lesser degree.

can someone ELI5 why Visa/MasterCard is frequently called a duopoly? as someone who mostly uses my amex and discover cards for day-to-day purchases, I don't really understand this. four major processors (two being their own issuers) seems like a decent amount of competition and diversity of offerings.

Only Visa/MasterCard matter outside USA.
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