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A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

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Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#71

Post by spodek »

objclxt wrote: post #38

When I talk to colleagues in tech about unions I hear a lot of misconceptions, seemingly based in stereotypes about what unions are for and who they serve. People often seem to think of unions as being purely blue-collar operations, and this just isn't true. For example, I've had people tell me that they don't support unions in tech because they'll be "paid less", or less competent engineers will be promoted faster.…

Hollywood makes a valid comparison for being nearby, but the more meaningful comparisons are to more unionized countries like in Europe or America in the past, where unions increased productivity, safety, and living standards.

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#72

Post by RickJWagner »

I've never been in a union, but I have 2 strong impressions of them from friends.

One friend was an electrician, he enjoyed working for a union because it gave him extra freedoms in his work.

The second friends father worked in management for a mine that used union labor. They went through an ugly labor strike where their windows were shot out of their house and their lives felt threatened.

I'm of mixed opinion, but the second scenario weighs heavily.

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#73

Post by KLexpat »

psaintlaurent wrote: post #5

I have an ugly truth for Google employees, unions don't mean anything, in NYC if you are in a union or married to a union employee you will eventually become a victim of targeted harassment campaigns by people with connections to government when they want you out of your job or spending money. Almost all unions or stable jobs have people who believe they "control" the jobs. They will attempt to destroy you and your f…

former resident of your property could have been mixed up with organised crime.

its common enough, you move into a house and random gangs show up looking for money etc that the previous resident owed them. They aren't going to take no for an answer because they'll get punished for not extracting wealth when they report back to el jefe

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#74

Post by kenhwang »

bitcharmer wrote: post #55
fovc wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One positive byproduct is that union membership is a quality signal for both employers and employees. I.e., as a producer, I know non-union candidates will be less experienced; as an employee I know a movie using non union labor is not going to run as smoothly. Could be good for the startup market if this additional data point becomes reliable

Genuine question as I don't know that industry at all. How does being a member of a union imply more experience?

The unions (edit: film industry) require a certain amount of work experience to join and some have different levels of membership depending on how much work you do after joining.

Because everyone prefers union workers, it creates a situation where the non-union worker has to get noticed somehow (nepotism or exceptional work) to convince someone to take a risk and hire them to earn enough work to gain union membership.

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#75

Post by ericol »

objclxt wrote: post #38

When I talk to colleagues in tech about unions I hear a lot of misconceptions, seemingly based in stereotypes about what unions are for and who they serve. People often seem to think of unions as being purely blue-collar operations, and this just isn't true. For example, I've had people tell me that they don't support unions in tech because they'll be "paid less", or less competent engineers will be promoted faster.…

I find really, really baffling the general position in the US regarding unions. It is like there's a general discourse that they are a bad thing, just like with "that other" thing (cough socialism cough).

This is even more strange when you find out about police unions - that are widespread -, and what their power is. From my point of view actions of police union are usually borderline "mob-like" (as in, I mostly hear about them when they save the necks of abusing and / or corrupted officers). It's like people think unions are generally bad, but then they have police unions everywhere and nobody bats an eye... even when their actions are on the shadowy side of things.

I didn't know about the film industry, thought (Even thought I remember about the writer's guild strike of a few years back).

Just like democracy, unions might be the worst solution, except for all the others.

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#76

Post by oh_sigh »

andai wrote: post #56
klaudius wrote: post #30

I don't understand unions. If they don't like certain behaviors that are legal like selling to government or paying high salaries, why are they working there in the first place? Just quit. Different people like different things, so go work somewhere that suits you.

The way I see it, if unions did nothing, Google and Amazon wouldn't be working so hard to prevent them from forming.

I think they think unions would drag down productivity and cost money. I don't know if anyone actually believes unions do nothing at all, neither good nor bad

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#77

Post by ignoramous »

objclxt wrote: post #38

When I talk to colleagues in tech about unions I hear a lot of misconceptions, seemingly based in stereotypes about what unions are for and who they serve. People often seem to think of unions as being purely blue-collar operations, and this just isn't true. For example, I've had people tell me that they don't support unions in tech because they'll be "paid less", or less competent engineers will be promoted faster.…

> For example, I've had people tell me that they don't support unions in tech because they'll be "paid less", or less competent engineers will be promoted faster.

Yeah, a bizarre line of reasoning. Footballers first unionized in 1907 and haven't looked back since. Today, your average footballer (plying their trade in the upper tiers of English football) makes more in a month than most tech engineers make in a year (granted careers are short and there are many more elite engineers than there are elite football players, but still, I don't think unionization had any effect on their salaries).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Footballers%27_As...

See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Tennis_Professi...

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#78

Post by giantg2 »

objclxt wrote: post #38

When I talk to colleagues in tech about unions I hear a lot of misconceptions, seemingly based in stereotypes about what unions are for and who they serve. People often seem to think of unions as being purely blue-collar operations, and this just isn't true. For example, I've had people tell me that they don't support unions in tech because they'll be "paid less", or less competent engineers will be promoted faster.…

I wouldn't look to SAG as a good example. The format of that industry is very different from most "typical" jobs, specifically tech work. I would also suggest looking at the the recent SAG healthcare fiasco.

Re: A group of Google workers have announced plans to unionize

#80

Post by mrweasel »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #16
amelius wrote: post #13

Perhaps App store publishers can unionize too. For example, instead of having small companies publishing apps themselves, they can have an organization do it for them, so it's big organization versus BigCorp, instead of little guy versus BigCorp. Also, it could provide some more transparency of the App Store sales.

Is there precedent for a group of unrelated individuals who happen to be in the same industry ‘unionizing’ ? Edit: answer of course is guilds, thanks commenters :) The word union threw me off. One could totally imagine an ‘app developers guild’ to help defend against the big guys. Go start one!

It's that pretty normal? That's what unions generally are, or am I misunderstanding your question. Denmark have/had unions for "office workers", engineers in general, steel workers and more. They are in the same industry, mostly, but they don't work for the same company.

The members of these unions are generally unrelated, they just have jobs in the same sector of industry or very similar education.

I think the weird part is when a union just represent the people working for one particular company.

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