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Start with pen and paper

sethetter.com

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Re: Start with pen and paper

#71

Post by rikroots »

sethetter wrote: post #54
Daub wrote: post #14

The article does not explain what the value of pen and paper has over a digital note pad. It just declares it has one. However, I can sympathize. I teach drawing and design. Of course, most of my students were raised on digital media. For some, their first experience drawing was digital! I have a lot of trouble explaining to them the value of pencil and paper. In “Personal Dynamic Media.” (1977) Kay, Alan and Goldber…

> The article does not explain what the value of pen and paper has over a digital note pad. It just declares it has one. The advantage is being clear from potential distractions. A lack of "features" providing a direct line of focus on what you're writing. Apologies if that wasn't clear from the article!

My preferred answer would be: no batteries required.

Re: Start with pen and paper

#72

Post by RcouF1uZ4gsC »

For me, it is clay tablet and stylus to really get rid of distractions. Even with pen and paper, I can find myself doodling. However, with a clay tablet I am focused. As a benefit, the process of going out and collecting the clay and forming it into a tablet gives me time to organize my thoughts. Then when I do put my thoughts down, I can bake it it the oven and know that it will last a few thousand years. Pen and paper seems so ethereal in comparison.

Re: Start with pen and paper

#73

Post by bee_rider »

M4v3R wrote: post #67
bayindirh wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you mean a digital notepad with no Internet access, then yes, that can be a solution too. Nothing beats the feeling of a real pen and paper for me. The texture of the paper and the feedback of the pen changes the experience a lot for me. Even if I've grown with computers and wanted my profession since forever, nothing beats paper (incl. e-paper/e-ink) when it comes to writing. Working with an analog medium compl…

Did you look into Remarkable e-paper tablet? [0] Many people swear by it because it supposedly has the feeling of paper when writing (the screen has a matte/rough texture). I've ordered one myself, haven't received yet so I can't vouch for whether those opinions are true or not, though. [0] http://remarkable.com

Haven't tried Remarkable. Did get the SO a wacom tablet last holiday season, seems to like it, I couldn't stand the thing. It feels kinda like using a pencil -- an unpleasantly thick one. I wonder if there could be an issue whereby the sort of folks who are OK with something feeling vaguely like writing on paper are already well served, but the really picky/peculiar people (I tend to stick to a particular brand of pencil and .3mm soft lead) are just living in this fat tail where the digital replacement will never be quite right.

I'd rather just write on the paper. I wish there was an easy way to digitize it, though.

Re: Start with pen and paper

#75

Post by mdparker89 »

Daub wrote: post #14

The article does not explain what the value of pen and paper has over a digital note pad. It just declares it has one. However, I can sympathize. I teach drawing and design. Of course, most of my students were raised on digital media. For some, their first experience drawing was digital! I have a lot of trouble explaining to them the value of pencil and paper. In “Personal Dynamic Media.” (1977) Kay, Alan and Goldber…

One benefit of the ethereal nature of digital is that editing is really easy which is part of what makes digital so appealing. The downside is that it makes it hard to silence your inner editor. Often the editor takes over before you even get to create.

Re: Start with pen and paper

#77

Post by jeppesen-io »

kissgyorgy wrote: post #23

This is the hole point why they created reMarkable, to basically disconnect you from the constant interruptions from today's world. You can read about this on their blog: https://blog.remarkable.com/ I got reMarkable 2 and it really works! Now I'm even making notes when I'm in front of my computer, it's way better feeling than typing.

Yes, i got one too. Biggest boost in productivity in years

Re: Start with pen and paper

#78

Post by jeppesen-io »

noir_lord wrote: post #44
hanche wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got the reMarkable 2 also, and I love it. There is one aspect of paper it does not really replicate well, though, and that is the ability to spread half a dozen sheets of paper in front of you for quick reference while you're working on your notes. Swiping between pages is too disruptive, not to mention jumping back and forth between notebooks.

How is the latency between interacting with pen/screen. I'm so tempted by these devices but that is my main concern, does it truly feel like pen on paper?

When i first got my rm2, i was looking for that latency, but noticed little. After ten min i forgot all about it

Re: Start with pen and paper

#79

Post by bayindirh »

M4v3R wrote: post #67
bayindirh wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you mean a digital notepad with no Internet access, then yes, that can be a solution too. Nothing beats the feeling of a real pen and paper for me. The texture of the paper and the feedback of the pen changes the experience a lot for me. Even if I've grown with computers and wanted my profession since forever, nothing beats paper (incl. e-paper/e-ink) when it comes to writing. Working with an analog medium compl…

Did you look into Remarkable e-paper tablet? [0] Many people swear by it because it supposedly has the feeling of paper when writing (the screen has a matte/rough texture). I've ordered one myself, haven't received yet so I can't vouch for whether those opinions are true or not, though. [0] http://remarkable.com

Yep. I know the device. While it's promising, e-ink has some inherent problems. Namely, color and speed.

I always design my software on paper first and, color is needed for diagrams. I also read academic papers a lot and use color-coded highlighters (remember / further research / etc.). Remarkable doesn't support these workflows.

e-ink is not a fast medium. I have an eBook reader (Kobo Glo HD / 300dpi) and I love it for reading but, highlighting process is slow and ugly (lower color depth -> overdrive for fast response -> repaint with correct gray levels -> done). Writing will be similar, with some lag and that's flow breaking and unacceptable for me.

At the end of the day, it's a good skeumorphic device which mimics paper albeit a rigid and slower one. On the other hand, paper's tactile response is unmatchable, especially when combined with fountain pens (which I use a lot).

Also, there are some ritualistic stuff with pen and paper. Every project has its own notebook, which triggers context response in my brain. When I get the notebook, I reload the stuff at the background. Every other task is automatically pushed back by the subconscious. It's a kind of leveraging the "library" system of the brain.

iPad pro has a faster screen and color but, backlit screens kill my eyes after a certain time period (All my panels are either OLED or high quality IPS with reduced blue light). I don't want to lose my eyesight for that.

I want to add that paper is hard to digitize, takes a lot of physical space and has maintenance but, these downsides are balanced out by the advantages it brings, at least for me.

I love working with digital systems. I use Pagico & Trello extensively. A digital diagram a lot. Keep structured knowledge bases in Evernote and Zim but, when it comes to thinking and documenting the thinking process, I always return to the pen & paper and, get that 10x boost instantly. I just can't replace it and I don't want to replace it anymore.

Trivia: Words like "On the other hand", "in that case", etc. comes from early memorization techniques where you imagine that you're actually putting that subject/idea in to your hand or a physical case which helps with structuring big subjects a lot. Using paper, different notebooks, etc. triggers the same circuitry to improve focus, retention and efficiency.

Re: Start with pen and paper

#80

Post by chriszhang »

lstodd wrote: post #42
wrp wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know people who are really happy with these, using the Staedtler correctable pens. I prefer a regular pad of paper, but it seems some people are made more comfortable working things out on an erasable medium.

A stack of paper and a 0.5mm HB pencil is the the best of both worlds.

Pencils don't do it for me. I find the color of the text written to be too faint for my comfort. Pens on the other hand write text in bright blue color which is I find more pleasing to read.
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