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Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

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Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#71

Post by mynegation »

refurb wrote: post #63
schoen wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

San Francisco has these signs on Ocean Beach: https://www.flickr.com/photos/c_nilsen/2823013166 They emphasize the concrete fact that people have actually died from the danger, which seems a little closer to your suggestion.

I’m wondering if the languages reflect who has died there? Spanish and Mandarin make sense based on SF demographics, but the Russian (?) seems out of place. Although I know the Outer Richmond has a good size Russian population. But if you at what languages SF offers information in, it usually also includes Japanese, Tagalog, Vietnamese and others, so I’m curious why they aren’t included.

It is indeed Russian and Russian people have a culture of enjoying swimming, sometimes combined with consumption of the alcohol. Combined with the fact that in Russia swimmable seas do not have rip currents, I would not be surprised if Russians disproportionately contributed to the sad statistics.

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#72

Post by PaulDavisThe1st »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #56
WalterBright wrote: post #35

In Seattle, the old I90 floating bridge across Lake Washington had a "bulge" where a section of the roadway could be pushed into the bulge to make room for boat passage. When the section was retracted, the highway abruptly ended, and a barrier was put up. The Bulge was infamous for traffic accidents where you suddenly had to swerve right then left then right at highway speed, with narrow lanes lined with concrete wal…

But do you remember what happened to the replacement the night before Clinton was inaugurated?

Does anyone downvoting this remember what happened to the replacement the night before Bill Clinton was inaugurated?

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#74

Post by Reason077 »

jedimastert wrote: post #27
supernova87a wrote: post #25

By the way, I wonder if there is something about liability in English law that enables this to continue to stay open and posted as a path? I would imagine that in the US, liability would quickly force local government / whoever to take down the signposts, as they "entice" people to think there is a safe, established path and should risk their lives and are probably somewhat liable for the result. I guess there aren't…

Historical British footpaths do actually have legal protections. Rights of way[0] belong to the people and are public property. Here's a Tom Scott talking about it (kinda)[1] [0]: https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Rights_of_way_in_England_and_Wal... [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dYc0Ouxhx0

Rights of way are legally protected, but are not necessarily public property. Footpaths and bridleways often cross privately owned land, especially in rural areas.

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#75

Post by philiplu »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #56
WalterBright wrote: post #35

In Seattle, the old I90 floating bridge across Lake Washington had a "bulge" where a section of the roadway could be pushed into the bulge to make room for boat passage. When the section was retracted, the highway abruptly ended, and a barrier was put up. The Bulge was infamous for traffic accidents where you suddenly had to swerve right then left then right at highway speed, with narrow lanes lined with concrete wal…

But do you remember what happened to the replacement the night before Clinton was inaugurated?

I assume you’re referring to the night they left the plug out? Or did something else happen during the Inaugaral Day windstorm in 1993?

For non-locals: Seattle is separated from the Eastside, the suburbs to the East, by Lake Washington. That lake is deep enough that the two bridges crossing it float on giant pontoons. In the early 90s, they were replacing the old Interstate 90 bridge, and doing some work on the old span in preparation. Someone decided that waste water from the process could be safely stored in those pontoons, so they removed the watertight caps. There was a big storm in late November 1990 which flooded the pontoons and sank the bridge. IIRC, that also damaged the cable supports for the replacement bridge, closing it down for a while.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lacey_V._Murrow_Memorial_Bridg...

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#76

Post by hnick »

Benjamin_Dobell wrote: post #29
csours wrote: post #26

Things that look and feel like something you've done a thousand times, and may do a thousand times again with no danger. Except that sometimes, things can change very quickly. There's a creek bed near me that dried out almost completely over the summer; usually there's some water flow and occasional shallow pools where small fish live. While it was completely dry, I wanted to walk as far downstream as I could. I woke…

As soon as it started raining, wouldn't you have just gotten out of the creek via the nearest embankment?

Flash floods can form out of sight. You might not have rain where you are, but the water is coming downstream.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p2vzhTMhW0

Now imagine you are in a gorge or choke point where it narrows suddenly.

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#77

Post by clairity »

nradov wrote: post #68
clairity wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, that's better, but in that case, it's about possible death (how possible?), rather than probable death, so it's (intentionally?) ambiguous. it seems to lack information about when rip currents are most likely, and more to the point, the statistical likelihood of death from entering the water at all. i'm personally not a strong swimmer so would avoid it anyways, but that information might more readily dissuade ot…

Death is not probable. A lot of people swim and surf there. The majority survive.

exactly, the sign's information is incomplete, so it's likely completely disregarded due to contrary social proof rather than through reasonable assessment.

rip currents apparently kill less than 100 people per year in the US (mostly weaker swimmers who panic).

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#78

Post by freefal »

ovi256 wrote: post #15
supernova87a wrote: post #7

It might be more honest and less surprising for the title to read: "Offshore path through tidal flats has killed 100+ people" I also recall another similar place in France where the path has small artificial posts/concrete piers built so that anyone caught out can climb to safety.

The one in France is the causeway to Noirmoutier island. It's a two way road that is impassable at high tide. At both ends, prominent panels display warnings, the current time and the time of the next high tide. Still, there are regular occurences of people that lose their cars and have to be rescued from the shelter poles, and, very rarely, worse. Incidentally, it's about the same length as this 3 mile path, 4.2 km.…

The Tour de France used this road in 1999 with predictable results: lots of crashes (https://www.procyclinguk.com/flashback-1999-tour-de-france/)

Re: Desolate English path has killed more than 100 people (2017)

#79

Post by supernova87a »

jedimastert wrote: post #27
supernova87a wrote: post #25

By the way, I wonder if there is something about liability in English law that enables this to continue to stay open and posted as a path? I would imagine that in the US, liability would quickly force local government / whoever to take down the signposts, as they "entice" people to think there is a safe, established path and should risk their lives and are probably somewhat liable for the result. I guess there aren't…

Historical British footpaths do actually have legal protections. Rights of way[0] belong to the people and are public property. Here's a Tom Scott talking about it (kinda)[1] [0]: https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Rights_of_way_in_England_and_Wal... [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dYc0Ouxhx0

I would guess this particular path into the sea doesn't need a lot of legalese about it.
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