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"Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

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Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#71

Maybe, donating to Mozilla would be nice, instead of giving to Wikipedia or other projects that don't need more money.

Donations to Mozilla go to Mozilla Foundation, the non-profit organization. These layoffs are in Mozilla Corporation, which doesn’t get the donated money and is mainly funded by the partnership with Google for the search engine setting in Firefox.

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#72
post #9

What is actually left of mozilla after this?

Roughly 75% of the workforce and of course all the IP.

That's a lot of people. Honest question: what are they working on? Not devtools, Servo, and not much Rust, MDN, Firefox, ... Which are about their only projects I know or care about.

What are the applying their formidable engineering talent to?

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#73
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For what it's worth, I agree with you. Chromium has won. It's the "Linux kernel" of web browsers. However, that DOESN'T necessarily mean that every Linux user has to run Ubuntu! I recently switched from Firefox to Vivaldi. Just because: 1. I got tired of nagging compatibility issues with websites that I can't easily do with out (e.g. bank and stock broker). 2. I dabbled with Opera once upon a time, and liked it. I do…

> I would love to have a browser that is both built on a Chromium core, AND built for privacy by a trustworthy open-source company. what about Brave?

I tried them for a little while.

Unfortunately, Brave's sync service just flat-out doesn't work. To the point where they have it disabled by default, and you have to crack open advanced settings to see if it will actually work reliably for you (SPOILER ALERT: It won't). I think they were too focused on making it "blockchain-based" and "crypto-trendy", and just can't build something sensible that works.

THIS is the value-add that browser vendors can bring to the table going forward. Chromium the kernel has won. But at the user-feature level:

1. Google and Microsoft's Chromium-based browsers spy on you.

2. Opera's Chromium-based browser has Chinese ownership, and probably spies on you.

3. Brave is buggy and flaky with all of the user features that they've built on top of their Chromium-based browser.

4. Vivalid's Chromium-based browser is pretty awesome and solid, and probably doesn't spy on you. But it's closed-source.

5. Firefox is solid, and has good no-spying values. But their browser is not Chromium-based, and it's dying because the Internet is simply moving on away from it.

With this list, Vivaldi is currently the "least-bad" option from my POV. But I would love to go back to Firefox if they would get real with the times.

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#74

Firefox doesn't have the developer tools that Chrome does so developers use Chrome to develop with meaning their websites work better in Chrome so Firefox is playing catch-up or just plain looks worse keeping adoption of Firefox lower. Mozilla solves the problem by killing development of developer tools insuring Firefox is an afterthought. Is there anyone in Mozilla management that has a technical bone in their body?

I'm sure management understands those teams are important. Who should they have cut instead? These are hard decisions. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that management doesn't understand tech, they obviously do, it's Mozilla.

> they obviously do

Only time will tell. If the ship finally does sink (i.e. gets acquired by IBM), then I'll take that as evidence that management decided to throw in the towel on figuring out tech and focus on short-term business instead.

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#75
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would love to have a browser that is both built on a Chromium core, AND built for privacy by a trustworthy open-source company. what about Brave?

I tried them for a little while. Unfortunately, Brave's sync service just flat-out doesn't work. To the point where they have it disabled by default, and you have to crack open advanced settings to see if it will actually work reliably for you (SPOILER ALERT: It won't). I think they were too focused on making it "blockchain-based" and "crypto-trendy", and just can't build something sensible that works. THIS is the va…

yeah I’m not a fan of brave either. wish they kept the crypto stuff separate

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#76

I wonder if Rust has enough momentum to sustain itself now.

Rust has plenty of momentum and non-Mozilla core team members and contributors, and has been in the process of finding or creating a foundation to organize under for some time. Of course this will slow the pace of development because so many talented and passionate people will have to move on, but it won't kill Rust.

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#77
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Roughly 75% of the workforce and of course all the IP.

That's a lot of people. Honest question: what are they working on? Not devtools, Servo, and not much Rust, MDN, Firefox, ... Which are about their only projects I know or care about. What are the applying their formidable engineering talent to?

Why would they work on the projects you or HN care about? This is why they got in trouble in the first place - spending money and engineering on projects with zero impact on their bottom line or on the metrics that matter around privacy and an open internet.

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#78
post #14

What's the focus of Mozilla now given the layoffs of Rust,MDN,Wasmtime and Servo? Is Mozilla/Firefox becoming VPN company?

My wholly unqualified opinion as forever firefox user: They are going to push their VPN, Pocket and Lockwise like never before. They are also going to focus on their incubator hoping for a big win. Firefox the browser will start to stagnate, and in five years or so they'll switch to WebKit. The focus is now not the browser or the browser engine. It's selling Fix-the-Internet type products that have a dash of security…

Pretty screwed up for a org that exists to write a web browser

Re: "Much" of the Rust/Wasmtime team hit by layoffs at Mozilla

#79
post #15

This shows that open-source in general is expensive for Mozilla but cheap for the likes of Apple, Microsoft and Google who own their own Web browsers and have other open-source programming languages maintained by some of their employees full time. The actual reality of this is that they are still kept alive by a direct competitor for decades and haven't made anything to generate significant sources of revenue. Maybe…

> " The actual reality of this is that they are still kept alive by a direct competitor for decades and haven't made anything to generate significant sources of revenue. Maybe they should turn into a Rust consultancy of some sort. I don't know. " The odds of them being able to build a business that that replaces the several hundred million they get from Google (which is essentially pure profit, not even revenue) are…

> The instant Google decides they're no longer useful, Mozilla is going to go poof.

People keep repeating this but couldn't Bing replace Google as the default? The "default search engine" position is actually worth money.

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