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TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

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Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#71

Post by FooBarWidget »

xvector wrote: post #39
puranjay wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This entire thing saddens me a great deal. It seems that you can just whip people up into a frenzy - even th HN crowd - simply by shouting "national security" and providing no proof to back it up. Has everyone really forgotten Saddam's WMDs so quickly?

I too was surprised that the HN crowd supported Trump’s and Microsoft’s actions so much. The people here are fairly intelligent and tend to have a good education. We are no stranger to history. We know that “national security risk” has been used to justify terrifying programs like PRISM and the Patriot Act. And despite having this in mind, so many folks here just openly supported what is effectively a hostile and coe…

People are normally skeptical of the US media and of government claims. Yet when it comes to China-related topics, people eat it all up, with minimal critical thinking, and even amplify them. China is not without problems, but people react so strongly to China-related issues that the subject is the perfect distraction, the perfect propaganda tool.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#72

Post by cainxinth »

patall wrote: post #70

Beside all the political issues, what is Microsoft actually supposedly buying here? The data centre, data and access to it? Because it does not seem to me that they are buying any of the developers, am I right? At least there is no talk about that. How well can you run a platform by buying its software without any of the people that run it, at least from my developer point of view that seems a very strange idea. Basi…

They don't need Tik Tok's tech. They want the brand and the youth demo it attracts.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#73

Post by FooBarWidget »

lovetocode wrote: post #31
chvid wrote: post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. The United States should be playing hard ball. The US TikTok systems are compromised by Chinese spammers already.

If the threat of Tiktok gathering data is so real, then isn't a much better solution, to pressure Google and Apple into improving their security models? That way, nobody can spy on your phone anymore. Or do you think Tiktok is the only and last threat there will ever exist?

But nobody's talking about actual solutions. All this looks more like a witch hunt to me.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#74

Post by 83457 »

vernie wrote: post #66
shusson wrote: post #14

> who saw value in an American company getting access to sophisticated TikTok algorithms Caused me to spit-take.

Why?

I'm guessing they believe it suggests a reason the current administration is pushing for the sale is to have some control over said algorithms and thus what videos are served, possibly to the benefit of the current administration and their interests.

"The proposed transaction gained the blessing of senior Trump officials, including Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin, who saw value in an American company getting access to sophisticated TikTok algorithms that decide what videos users are served."

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#75

Post by whoevercares »

patall wrote: post #70

Beside all the political issues, what is Microsoft actually supposedly buying here? The data centre, data and access to it? Because it does not seem to me that they are buying any of the developers, am I right? At least there is no talk about that. How well can you run a platform by buying its software without any of the people that run it, at least from my developer point of view that seems a very strange idea. Basi…

How did you know they won’t acquire the talents? Is it because... those people might be Chinese engineers?

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#76

Post by FooBarWidget »

borg_ wrote: post #69
lovetocode wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. The United States should be playing hard ball. The US TikTok systems are compromised by Chinese spammers already.

> Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. Comment like this lumps tiktok, a privately owned company with the Chinese government with no evidence. It's never about national security but really about US politicians seeing a social network with real reach in the US that for the first time does NOT need to pay to lobby in the US, nor to be responsive to congressional inquiry (as they have been able to do rec…

It's worse than that. The hostilities towards everything China in 2020 are pushing all sorts of Chinese people away, who otherwise would have been supportive of US and liberal values.

What baffles me is that nobody knows that this is happening. Nobody is trying to understand how the other side sees it, and to work towards a real solution. Or maybe people are just wilfully blind to this possibility. People are so convinced that their view is the only possible legitimate view, and that no other legitimate views could possibly exist.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#77

Post by someperson »

hellomyguys wrote: post #62
someperson wrote: post #12

It continues to be damning that the leadership of Microsoft did not buy Vine [1] from Twitter in 2017 for pennies on the dollar before Vine was shutdown. Vine was very popular, and a lot of people were very disappointed when it was shutdown back when Twitter was bleeding a lot cash. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vine_(service)

Honestly hard to tell if this is satire. TikTok is way more compelling than Vine was, even at its peak. The idea that Microsoft not buying a dying Vine from Twitter is indicative of its poor leadership is hard to wrap my head around.

People are talking about Microsoft paying more than $30 billion for TikTok's operations in just four countries. Vine was losing Twitter 10 million dollars a month at a time when Twitter was desperate for cash.

Microsoft (or Google, or Facebook, or any similar cash rich company) could have bought Vine for tens of millions.

The product and algorithm could have been tweaked to be more compelling. Even if the new owner wasn't able to do that, using an existing established platform/audience then cloning the features of upcoming competitors is very powerful.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#78

Post by treis »

mcintyre1994 wrote: post #18
1f60c wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Am I being naive? Possibly. Axios[0] quotes Trump as saying: “A very substantial portion of that price is going to have to come into the Treasury of the United States. Because we’re making it possible for this deal to happen. Right now they don’t have any rights, unless we give it to them. So if we’re going to give them the rights, it has to come into this country. It’s a little bit like the landlord/tenant”. Make…

I'm probably being stupid, but how is that not absolutely terrifying for US companies? The deal seems to be that all acquisition of foreign companies has to have a kickback to the treasury because they could always just ban the company you bought otherwise?

Trump's a blow hard. What he says means little compared to what he actually does. MS probably won't end up paying an acquisition fee. At worst it will be some tax pre-payment or some other nonsense that Trump can claim as a victory.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#79

Post by andreilys »

Hokusai wrote: post #30
chvid wrote: post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

> Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company Wouldn't do this make sense for Facebook? I would like to see a European company owning the European side of Facebook. I really like Silicon Valley and their initiative, but again and again American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data (maybe USA data either, but that is an inter…

I really like Silicon Valley and their initiative, but again and again American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data

Source?

Btw HSBC [1], Unilever [2] and many other European companies have had customer data breaches. I’m sure there would be even more but Europe has almost no top internet consumer companies

So I don’t have a lot of trust in European companies to safeguard customer data, curious to hear why you do.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveywinder/2018/11/06/hsbc-ban...

https://www.verdict.co.uk/fresh-film-data-breach-dove/

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#80

Post by sandworm101 »

patall wrote: post #70

Beside all the political issues, what is Microsoft actually supposedly buying here? The data centre, data and access to it? Because it does not seem to me that they are buying any of the developers, am I right? At least there is no talk about that. How well can you run a platform by buying its software without any of the people that run it, at least from my developer point of view that seems a very strange idea. Basi…

TikTok users. Microsoft is bidding to purchase Tiktok's user base.

Data centers, even engineering talent, is fungible. They are replaceable and therefore have no special value worth haggling over. But attractive young people wanting to dump their lives into a video app for pennies? That is the real asset in this deal.

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