H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S. • Hacker News Board

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#71

Post by e9 » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:07 AM UTC

arcticbull wrote: post #15

rpiguy wrote: post #12

The H-1B program is terrible and needs to be reformed. It is supposed to temporarily shore up the supply of critically skilled workers that are in demand. While it does this, when the program was envisioned no one imagined H-1B visa holders working here for 10+ years. If only there were a word for the importation of minority labor and locking them into employment with their sponsor, effectively reducing their negotia…

> If only there were a word for the importation of minority labor and locking them into employment with their sponsor, effectively reducing their negotiating power for salary to zero... It really doesn't do that. To be fair, H-1Bs are supposed to be in-demand specialty workers, to meet the spirit of the program. That means they have, by definition, negotiating power. I've spent a lot of time in H-1 status and I have…

Yes it does do that and worse. When I was on H1b years back in big co, most of my coworkers were on h1b as well and they were scared to death to leave because of comfort and self doubt. Some manager knew this and abused this power by pointing out that their green card application can be withdrawn any moment if they don’t work on weekends.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#72

Post by rtkwe » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:09 AM UTC

jacobriis wrote: post #16

Looks like about 25% of software developers (broadly defined) are on H1B visas. 254k/365k of H1B petitions in 2017 were for computer occupations (those are predominantly in software development and computer programming). If we assume the proportion of actual workers is similar to petitions, we would assume there are about 400k H1B workers in software. About 1.5 million were employed in software development and comput…

CS seems pretty easy for H1B to fulfill the 'unable to find a worker in the US' because there's always another library an employer can say is required for the job.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#73

Post by monoideism » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:11 AM UTC

moultano wrote: post #52

monoideism wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Economists have researched that data, and consistently confirmed what the GP asserted: "Research by Daniel Costa, of the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, and Howard University political science professor Ron Hira, found that 60% of H-1B workers receive lower-than-average wages for their job and region. Google, Facebook and Apple “take advantage of program rules in order to legally pay many of their H-1B worker…

This paper is really shoddy work. It doesn't even account for the fact that most H1B workers are early in their career and thus more junior employees.

If you want to convince people, please post a paper supporting your point of view, then. My mind is open. I've found one such paper described here, but haven't yet found the original paper:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stuartanderson/2020/05/19/immig...

If it's accurately described, I have some problems with this one, but still looking for the original.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#74

Post by kyawzazaw » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:12 AM UTC

baby wrote: post #30

The H-1B system is terrible. I applied twice to it while I was on an internship visa, and ended up not getting through the lottery and had to leave the US. Then had to wait a year and a half to get a greencard in order to come back.

How were you able to get the greencard in that short time frame?

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#75

Post by rtkwe » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:15 AM UTC

gruez wrote: post #19

baggy_trough wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want the government to be more effective and efficient at tracking people?

They already: * have access to your internet usage, search history, and phone records * track our location through cellphones * have surveillance cameras everywhere, in case you didn't bring your phone * track where your cars is through a vast network of ANPRs * fly drones/planes over cities doing aerial surveillance And you think that tracking the number of H1B visa holders is too much?

The roadblock as always is bringing all that info together. Few places have access to all that information and a way to synthesize it together.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#76

Post by ardit33 » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:16 AM UTC

arcticbull wrote: post #15

rpiguy wrote: post #12

The H-1B program is terrible and needs to be reformed. It is supposed to temporarily shore up the supply of critically skilled workers that are in demand. While it does this, when the program was envisioned no one imagined H-1B visa holders working here for 10+ years. If only there were a word for the importation of minority labor and locking them into employment with their sponsor, effectively reducing their negotia…

> If only there were a word for the importation of minority labor and locking them into employment with their sponsor, effectively reducing their negotiating power for salary to zero... It really doesn't do that. To be fair, H-1Bs are supposed to be in-demand specialty workers, to meet the spirit of the program. That means they have, by definition, negotiating power. I've spent a lot of time in H-1 status and I have…

This is so wrong, it is comical. You have a lot less leverage, especially if you want/are in the process of getting a green card.

As a former H1B holder (and currently on a Green Card), being on a H-1B has prevented me:

1. Not accepting a higher salary offer, but going with a more 'safe option'

2. Having to negotiate for asap Green Card application, vs. salary

3. Not being able to accept a promotion to a manager, as I had a ongoing Green Card application as engineer/ic, and that would jeopardize my green card application

4. Not being able to create, or join a very early startup

5. Having high anxiety, for all the paperwork required, and the RFE recieved after switching jobs...

6. Inability to switch jobs, if you have a Perm/Green Card application ongoing, as it will rest it (even for non-capped countries, it might take 2+ years for the whole process to go through)

etc... etc..

You must be young and naive if you believe being on a H1B doesn't suppress one's salary, or potential.

The current H1B system is in-tenured servitude, and a continuation of old Feudal System, by tying the ability to work for a class of workers to their employer. Yes, you can switch employers, but at great costs, and at risking eventual deportation (if you don't play the immigration game right, and get the Perm/Green Card in time).

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#77

Post by djhaskin987 » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:19 AM UTC

jypepin wrote: post #2

"estimate"? How can they not know exactly how many people have H1bs?

Clearly you did not read the article.

In there it clearly states that it is because there is no electronic tracking system of any kind. They're trying to figure out the estimates based on paper records.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#78

Post by frostburg » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:23 AM UTC

29athrowaway wrote: post #68

frostburg wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a friend with an EB-1 visa. She's good ("alien of exceptional ability") at her job I suppose, which is being a porn actress. Somewhat hilariously it was rather easy for her to meet the criteria (international prizes, being highly paid compared to peers, commercial success, being published in media etc.).

Today, in things that never happened...

I very much doubt that she's the only one. Apparently Melania Trump had one, too - I suspect that a good immigration lawyer can be very helpful in this sort of thing if some conceivable way to argue that you meet the requirements exists.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#79

Post by Grakel » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:26 AM UTC

moultano wrote: post #46

monoideism wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Those big tech companies already have international offices. Why wouldn't they have just expanded those offices? Because they still want to hire lots of Americans. They just don't want to pay them market prices. So they bring in H1-Bs to lower wages. If they hired them overseas, there wouldn't be that effect: From the article above: "Research by Daniel Costa, of the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, and Howar…

The H1B program is the only reason the US has a tech industry at all. 75% of silicon valley tech workers are immigrants.

Lol. The fact that the entire concept was invented here probably would contradict that.

Re: H-1B: Government issues first-ever official estimate of visa population in U.S.

#80

Post by alphachloride » Tue, Jul 07, 2020, 1:28 AM UTC

djhaskin987 wrote: post #77

jypepin wrote: post #2

"estimate"? How can they not know exactly how many people have H1bs?

Clearly you did not read the article. In there it clearly states that it is because there is no electronic tracking system of any kind. They're trying to figure out the estimates based on paper records.

I would suggest that you take a look at the guidelines[1] for hacker news, which I believe set a good standard for productive discourse. Particularly:

> Please don't comment on whether someone read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that."

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html