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iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

macrumors.com

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Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#71

Post by nix23 »

panpanna wrote: post #66
leadingthenet wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But please note that Apple does this after years of pressure from EU and are one of the last companies to do so. I have no idea what you’re talking about. When exactly did the EU ask Apple not to include the charger in the box? I’m very doubtful of this claim.

If you Google "EU charger" this The Verge article will be the top result: "Since 2009, the European Commission has been trying to convince tech companies to adopt a single charging method for our gadgets, primarily smartphones, in a quest to reduce the waste that comes when every new gadget you buy includes yet another AC adapter in the box. Now, Apple’s Lightning connector may be at risk." https://www.theverge.com/2…

Yes that means that you can charge your Android an Iphone with the SAME charger, NOT that you don't include one with your phone.

And yet Apple could avoid implementing micro/usb-c (or the standard EU-Smart-device charger hm-hmm) etc since 11 Years and nothing happened...thanks EU for your strong fist and small mouth.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#72

Post by arghwhat »

makomk wrote: post #52
arghwhat wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully you don't have micro-USB chargers , but USB chargers and micro-usb cables. I don't use Apple products, but reducing waste like this is great. Most people should have buckets of chargers by now, and even if they lack the cable, it's better to buy when needed.

Probably, but that doesn't work so well for USB-C - you really need it end to end in order to get the best charging performance, and the rumour is that Apple will only include a USB-C to Lightning cable with no standard USB equivalent. Also, Apple's official cables cost about as much as a charger on their own last time I checked, and they've done quite a lot of work to lock out unofficial ones.

> you really need it end to end in order to get the best charging performance,

For reference, most USB-C phones currently ship with USB-A chargers, just like Apple didn't ship the iPad with the big USB-C charger when it was released.

But, the point is that you don't need that many wallwarts, and they're wasteful. When your laptop, game console and whatever all use the same power supply, you end up only needing one or two.

> and they've done quite a lot of work to lock out unofficial ones.

Apple is fully complaint and interoperable in their current offerings (I recall HP locked out foreign chargers, but I hope they stopped that).

My wife's MacBook Pro is fully compatible with my Nintendo Switch[1], Dell, CalDigit and other USB-PD chargers and type-C cables, just like my Android phone, Dell XPS 13, Nintendo Switch[1], and more can charge from her chargers and cables.

Compare that to a few years ago where all these products had proprietary chargers...[2]

-----

1: No, the Nintendo Switch and PSU is not dangerous, and work fine with all USB-PD devices. The problem is when the dock is in play, where everything goes whack, and third-party docks can cause issues there.

2. The "oh no, cables and ports are all different" isn't a problem, despite what HN/reddit wants you to believe. Super cheap, super thin USB-C cables aren't rated for TB3/100W charge, but that's a surprise to no one. Plug anything into a decently rated power supply and cable, and it'll just work.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#73

Post by arghwhat »

kohtatsu wrote: post #44
arghwhat wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully you don't have micro-USB chargers , but USB chargers and micro-usb cables. I don't use Apple products, but reducing waste like this is great. Most people should have buckets of chargers by now, and even if they lack the cable, it's better to buy when needed.

[With regards to waste;] 3rd party chargers have been ridiculously unreliable with the lightning connector. No idea what is so hard to get right, but I've never had a ~$10 cable last more than a year, sometimes just a couple months or a week. I'm not particularly rough with them, just plug them in a couple times a day at my desk or bed. Sometimes my girlfriend's iPhone uses my charger as well, which can seem to exped…

My wife has gone through so god damn many of those cables. They all end up corroding.

Finally got her a Qi charger, as her iPhone 10 supports it. Solves part of the issue.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#74

Post by JustResign »

nailer wrote: post #64
moron4hire wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voltage is standardized

I know with regular USB C (not USB C to lightning), it's definitely not standardized - some chargers output 5V, some 20V, some 45V. Are you saying lightning changes this?

USB PD involves negotiation -- the charger doesn't just "push" 20V to a device that isn't asking for it.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#75

Post by arghwhat »

rbinv wrote: post #63
arghwhat wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully you don't have micro-USB chargers , but USB chargers and micro-usb cables. I don't use Apple products, but reducing waste like this is great. Most people should have buckets of chargers by now, and even if they lack the cable, it's better to buy when needed.

> Hopefully you don't have micro-USB chargers, but USB chargers and micro-usb cables. Yes, I should have clarified that. I don't have any USB-C cables either, for that matter. My chargers only put out 18 W at the most, so things like PD (Power Delivery) wouldn't work anyway.

True, but at least we finally have a single spec for charging instead of the madness of proprietary things we had before...

It's really nice to just have one PD charger in my bag for everything.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#76

Post by whywhywhywhy »

leadingthenet wrote: post #11
whywhywhywhy wrote: post #5

These petty BOM reduction exercises from Tim Cook's Apple to claw back single dollars on products that are $1000 are starting to get egregious.

They also reduce e-waste. Few people need yet another lightning / micro-usb / usb-c cable and charger.

Please don't try and pretend the company that invented AirPods cares a single bit about e-waste.

Just how many pairs of AirPods is the average Apple fan going to go through in their lives. These things are going to be rotting away in landfills and washing up on beaches for multiple generations after their wearers are dead.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#77

Post by panpanna »

nix23 wrote: post #71
panpanna wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you Google "EU charger" this The Verge article will be the top result: "Since 2009, the European Commission has been trying to convince tech companies to adopt a single charging method for our gadgets, primarily smartphones, in a quest to reduce the waste that comes when every new gadget you buy includes yet another AC adapter in the box. Now, Apple’s Lightning connector may be at risk." https://www.theverge.com/2…

Yes that means that you can charge your Android an Iphone with the SAME charger, NOT that you don't include one with your phone. And yet Apple could avoid implementing micro/usb-c (or the standard EU-Smart-device charger hm-hmm) etc since 11 Years and nothing happened...thanks EU for your strong fist and small mouth.

Aren't you misunderstanding the directive?

The EU explicitly stated the goal was to reduce e-waste, and the only way to do that is by not shipping a new charger with every phone.

Apple avoided all this by providing USB-lightning converters. This follows the letter of law but produces even more waste. Eventually EU decided they had enough and threatened to fine Apple.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#78

Post by nix23 »

panpanna wrote: post #77
nix23 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes that means that you can charge your Android an Iphone with the SAME charger, NOT that you don't include one with your phone. And yet Apple could avoid implementing micro/usb-c (or the standard EU-Smart-device charger hm-hmm) etc since 11 Years and nothing happened...thanks EU for your strong fist and small mouth.

Aren't you misunderstanding the directive? The EU explicitly stated the goal was to reduce e-waste, and the only way to do that is by not shipping a new charger with every phone. Apple avoided all this by providing USB-lightning converters. This follows the letter of law but produces even more waste. Eventually EU decided they had enough and threatened to fine Apple.

>reduce e-waste

Yes so you dont have two incompatible chargers when apple decides to change the plug again...that's when it started, that was 2009.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#79

Post by nailer »

JustResign wrote: post #74
nailer wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know with regular USB C (not USB C to lightning), it's definitely not standardized - some chargers output 5V, some 20V, some 45V. Are you saying lightning changes this?

USB PD involves negotiation -- the charger doesn't just "push" 20V to a device that isn't asking for it.

Exactly. So: non-tech aware customer has a 5v USB 3 charger, buys an iPhone 12, and wonder why it charges 10x slower than their friend's new phone.

Re: iPhone 12 Models Won't Include Charger in Box, Power Adapter Sold Separately

#80

Post by lorenzhs »

rbinv wrote: post #65
lorenzhs wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the time when people have trouble with charging cables, it's caused by pocket lint in the phone's charging port, so maybe try that? I use a bent paperclip, but I'm sure there are more gentle ways.

Couldn't a paperclip potentially short the "pins"?

Maybe, but there’s nothing to short without a cable plugged in afaik? I don’t think the voltage lines are powered in the idle state. I’ve never had a problem at least.
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