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Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

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Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#71

Post by barbegal »

hannob wrote: post #40
barbegal wrote: post #15

The methodology mentions nothing about randomization so its unclear if there was any selection bias here. If you look a table 2, the control group was on average 6 years older and had more co-morbidities. This suggests that there was some selection bias and that other undocumented factors could have greatly affected this experiment. Doing multi-variate analysis with such a small sample size gives rise to huge uncerta…

It's an observational study, which by definition is not randomized. It's pure association, it may very well be pure confounding. In favor of the authors: The only thing they really claim is that an RCT should be done. Which I guess is an okay'ish conclusion from such a study.

I'm just slightly surprised that the study wasn't made randomized. I can't see any ethical reason why that couldn't have been done but maybe there were logistical reasons.

Larger randomized trials are in progress [1][2] but the results won't be published until July.

[1] https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04344041 [2] https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04351490.

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#72

Post by Nursie »

partyboat1586 wrote: post #62
Nursie wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans have the most expensive piss in the world. Yes, unless you have good reason to think you have a deficiency, supplements are a waste of time and money. And even if you do have reason to think you might have a deficiency there are often better (usually dietary) ways to address it.

Americans have expensive piss because of the expensive pharmacological drugs you take. Vitamins are very cheap.

What's this "you" business? I'm not American. Vitamins absolutely contribute to this, and many/most you take will be excreted again.

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#73

Post by tcoff91 »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #37
Traubenfuchs wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right and it is no secret: - 40% of US Americans are B12 deficient https://www.livekindly.co/b12-deficiency-genetic-makeup/#:~:... . - 42% are Vitamin D deficient: https://www.cantonmercy.org/healthchat/42-percent-of-america... . - up to 50% are Magnesium deficient: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/02/180226122548.h... - 10 - 20% of women are iron deficient: https://www.aafp.org/afp/2007/0301/p671.h…

Presumably it's relatively easy for a lab to run a panel of tests on me and say "you're deficient in X, Y, Z; try eating more A B C; spend 30mins extra a week outside; drink less alcohol". How easy is it too get such tests (in UK), I'm surprised we don't seem to have anything like this as part of our health system. I've had blood pressure and height/weight taken a couple of times (I'm middle aged). But that's about a…

For some nutrients it’s easy to test for, for others the tests are controversial with regards to accuracy.

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#74

Post by 0-_-0 »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #53
arghzzz wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

However, taking 3 vitamins is almost entirely harmless.

Vitamin overdoses can be serious in the worst cases. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_A https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_D

The study is not suggesting the administration of toxic amounts of vitamin D

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#75

Post by [deleted] »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #37
Traubenfuchs wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right and it is no secret: - 40% of US Americans are B12 deficient https://www.livekindly.co/b12-deficiency-genetic-makeup/#:~:... . - 42% are Vitamin D deficient: https://www.cantonmercy.org/healthchat/42-percent-of-america... . - up to 50% are Magnesium deficient: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/02/180226122548.h... - 10 - 20% of women are iron deficient: https://www.aafp.org/afp/2007/0301/p671.h…

Presumably it's relatively easy for a lab to run a panel of tests on me and say "you're deficient in X, Y, Z; try eating more A B C; spend 30mins extra a week outside; drink less alcohol". How easy is it too get such tests (in UK), I'm surprised we don't seem to have anything like this as part of our health system. I've had blood pressure and height/weight taken a couple of times (I'm middle aged). But that's about a…

[deleted]

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#76

Post by ageitgey »

rmelhem wrote: post #30

just a personal note, I had many many respiratory tract problems - tonsillitis, flu, cold, at least 3 times a year. I always thought it was something natural, given the seasonality of these diseases, especially in winter. but after a routine blood test, my doctor prescribed vitamin D because mine was way below recommended. since 2017, when i started taking vitamin D supplementation, only a mild flu is what I had in 3…

There were big studies in 2016/2017 that demonstrated the connection between Vitamin D and lowering the incidence of colds and other respiratory infections. This led to some governments (like the UK) recommending universal daily supplements for all citizens during the winter months.

See https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/02/170216110002.h...

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#77

Post by elric »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #37
Traubenfuchs wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right and it is no secret: - 40% of US Americans are B12 deficient https://www.livekindly.co/b12-deficiency-genetic-makeup/#:~:... . - 42% are Vitamin D deficient: https://www.cantonmercy.org/healthchat/42-percent-of-america... . - up to 50% are Magnesium deficient: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/02/180226122548.h... - 10 - 20% of women are iron deficient: https://www.aafp.org/afp/2007/0301/p671.h…

Presumably it's relatively easy for a lab to run a panel of tests on me and say "you're deficient in X, Y, Z; try eating more A B C; spend 30mins extra a week outside; drink less alcohol". How easy is it too get such tests (in UK), I'm surprised we don't seem to have anything like this as part of our health system. I've had blood pressure and height/weight taken a couple of times (I'm middle aged). But that's about a…

I can't speak for all nutrients, but it's nearly impossible to detect magnesium deficiency in blood tests. Presumably, other nutrients might be difficult to check as well. Which makes the tests misleading or downright wrong.

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#78

Post by eloff »

dwheeler wrote: post #7
ageitgey wrote: post #2

N=43 (17 given vitamins vs 26 not) Highlights: "Significantly fewer DMB patients than controls required initiation of oxygen therapy subsequently throughout their hospitalization (17.6% vs 61.5%, P=0.006)." "DMB combination in older COVID-19 patients was associated with a significant reduction in proportion of patients with clinical deterioration requiring oxygen support and/or intensive care support. This study supp…

The number of people in the study is too small to really make much in the way of definitive conclusions. But it is certainly enough that a larger study should occur. In the meantime, since vitamins are cheap and not dangerous at these doses, it seems a reasonable measure to go ahead and take them. They might help, there's weak evidence to suggest that they might, and they shouldn't hurt. However, it's important not t…

You're not going to overdose vitamin D at 1000 IU. Do your own research, but the RDA is too low for people living in the northern hemisphere. I'm a computer programmer living in Canada, I take 3000 IU a day. A good sun exposure can produce 50,000 IU, not all of which gets absorbed.

If you have too much over a long period of time it can cause calcification. You're probably not going to experience that under 10000 IU a day. Again, do your own research. I'm not an expert in this field.

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#79

Post by ageitgey »

7thaccount wrote: post #63
Spooky23 wrote: post #8

Was this known early on about COVID? Early on in the lockdown I noticed that these vitamins were among the kind of weird items completely cleared out of stores. People were very selective... initially all FHD laptops and Chromebooks were gone, along with power strips, ibuprofen, hair clippers, etc.

Chromebooks are good for a lot of things (especially entertaining young kids) and are cheap. I find the quality to be much better than kid tablets which are terribly glitchy. A Windows laptop with only 2 GB of RAM (shocked you could still get that little) is like $400 and much larger than a Chromebook. Powerstrips are necessary for makeshift home offices which are now everywhere. Hairclippers are important for people…

Are you a GPT-2 bot or something?

Re: Study of the effect of Vitamin D, Magnesium and Vitamin B12 on Covid-19 patients

#80

Post by rrmm »

smilespray wrote: post #10
rrmm wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah this seems like it'd be much easier to roll out on wide spread basis than HCQ. With an appropriate caution about dosage consulting a doc before making any changes, they're all water soluble. That there statement about the limits of the study should be taken to heart. People seem to get too fixated on the first results they hear and hold on to them more strongly than subsequent results which can often provide bet…

Surely Vitamin D is fat soluble?

Ahh you are right, thanks for the correction.

D looks like upper tolerable dosage is around 4000IU/day for 9+ years old. Some studies apparently see overt toxicity after several months of 50000IU/day dosages.

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