Title should contain "written in C++" (as this also happens all the time with Rust).
Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
71–80 of 105 posts
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#72Author here, ask me anything.
How is this different from LibrePCB and why you have not joined forces together?
I only got to know about LibrePCB at the end of 2016 after several months of development on Horizon EDA. While there are some similarities such as the use of UUIDs and strong link between schematic and netlist, there are major architectural differences such as Horizon EDA using raw OpenGL vs QTSceneGraph(?) and Gtkmm vs QT.
As far as I can tell, the development models also differ significantly: The LibrePCB devs seem to be focused on doing things the right way the first time such as having a proper operation-based undo/redo stack whereas horizon just stores a copy of the whole schematic/board for undo/redo. They also seem to focus more on simplicity for beginners rather than more advanced features such as length tuning and advanced design rules.
Putting development effort where I like enabled me do to the board for my master thesis https://github.com/carrotIndustries/x-band-tx/ (4 Layers, differential pairs, length-matched traces) in Horizon EDA only after about 2 years after the initial beginning of development.
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#73Author here, ask me anything.
Just installed it and tried it: 1. Opening up your first project is not straightforward. Instead of just opening with a blank project and letting you add a resistor, the app asks a lot of rather irritating and irrelevant questions (who cares who the "author" is at creation time, and couldn't it guess anyways?) that could be better decided later. Worst offense: the "create" button is grayed. As in: nope, you won't be…
As a longtime horizon user (at least relative to the time this project exists), some of the points you mentioned are definitly on the radar:
- Navigation Buttons: I proposed a solution here: https://github.com/horizon-eda/horizon/issues/119#issuecomme... This is part of the effort to add icons and toolbars to things that right now are reachable behind the spacebar menu
- Many TH (as well as audio/synthesizer-related) parts can be found in the work branch of my fork of the offical pool: https://github.com/atoav/horizon-pool/tree/work The offical library/pool only includes parts that have been checked by four eyes, so many parts are still open as Pull requests: https://github.com/horizon-eda/horizon-pool/pulls
As for the other points:
- on 1: Starting projects: for me it is only entering a project title and selecting a path, which is reasonable unless you are the type who wants to decide things like these in the end on saving.
- on 2: While I also like single window concepts better (with panes like Blender), I think having schematic, board and pool/library editors in seperate windows is kinda reasonable.
- on 4: You actually can. You are not forced to use existing parts if you use "Place component"
- on 6: Given how the whole thing works, such a thing like "Part properties" doesn't really make sense. In Horizon everything you place on the schematic is either a generic unit (E.g. "Two-terminal resistor") where you can enter a value or a existing part mapped to this generic unit (e.g. a "ERJ-6ENF2003"). This is (on purpose) different from how other EDA-tools do it, but in practise it works quite well. The point on the different assign window is something I'd like to have changed as well : )
- on 8: if you want to move something you have to use the move tool which you invoke by pressing the m key. You can also move things with the arrow keys.
Generally the UX paradigm of horizon is very much built around single key shortcuts or key sequences. And if you don't know the keys just press the spacebar and search for the command and it will tell you right there.
As for now the experience for power users is very fluid, but when it comes to installation, onboarding etc. the whole thing could use a lot of improvement (and are gladly beeing worked on).
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#74Author here, ask me anything.
Nice work! The world badly needs a FOSS EDA program that isn't insane. Any plans for Mac downloads? And also, does its component model separate out schematic symbols and pin assignment (like DesignSpark PCB and I assume others) or are they inseparable (like KicadPCB)?
Horizon probaly has the most flexible and modular library concept there I ever saw. You can reuse things, inherit from things etc.
This is a good summery (with a nice graphic of the structure of an example part): https://horizon-eda.readthedocs.io/en/latest/pool-why.html
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#75The PCB EDA space really needs some competition. Kicad is really getting there, it "just" needs some UI improvements (Automation of the Schematic->Netlist->pcbnew flow would be nice) and also some of the big boy features like signal integrity and heat etc. Altium is probably the only clean PCB experience at the moment, and even that sits at 10% CPU on my machine with an empty schematic and no PCB open. The more esote…
As an absolute beginner learning how to design PCBs and simple circuits for hobby projects - I have to say while KiCAD is getting there, it really still has a learning-curve of a sheer cliff. The interface and workflow seem arbitrary and unnecessary complex for what should be a relatively straightforward process. I realize this tool is far more powerful than I'll ever need but it really does feel like I'm in way over…
For simple projects, EasyEDA is basic but simple to use and free.
Nice feature is that sending your boards to JLCPCB is a click away as well as ordering some parts from LCSC as they are all the same company and many components are already defined.
Although, like any other EDA, you really need to check the footprints or make your own.
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ok but I think this really should be a separate application. Let's stick with the Unix philosophy and have many tools that do one task well.
Absolutely! As long as those tools can communicate with each other à la unix pipes
Why limit with OS specific tools? Why not just communicate via markup files?
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#77Would love to see more features supporting RF. Obviously the dream would be a 2D or 2.1D mesh/simulate built in, but would settle for less. An easy starting point is better import/export of layouts. Designing an antenna in my RF-specific CAD suite is great, but when I actually have to build the thing, all I get is DXFs. Converting DXF to gerbers is a mess in KiCAD. Same goes if I want to reverse the pipe and simulate…
Ok but I think this really should be a separate application. Let's stick with the Unix philosophy and have many tools that do one task well.
Ugh, no. I have been using RF CAD since HP MDS. You’ll end up with a convoluted mess like ADS, where the EM package is now a separate application from the main package. I ditched it 20 years ago; good riddance.
The Microwave Office guys knew this 25 years ago, which is why it’s so much better than ADS. It is all tightly integrated and object oriented.
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
I wish they had git or something built into KiCad, specially to update parts and be able to find libraries, instead having to search for them online and downloading and extracting and adding to two places in the software.
This is my biggest gripe with KiCAD. No matter what I do, my libraries end up messy.
Another thing I wish they had. something to help pick the right sizes, for stuff like capacitors.
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
Scroll wheel and middle mouse button, as commonly used in most software. Home button reframes the view.
In my commonly used software I click on damn things, little boxes appear on corners and I can just drag them in/out to decrease/increase the size. Or if 3D software I have 3 more lines to rotate/roll for each axis. That's my commonly used software.
EDA is a type of CAD software, there's a bit more to it than "baby's first schematic editor".
Things are going to be different and if that's what's making you quit the software I have to imagine you wouldn't even be using it anyway and you just thought it looked cool despite not being an actual EDA user.
Re: Horizon – a free and open source electronic PCB design package
#80Tangent: I'm about to start learning EDA and what I really want is a data format for my designs. Something that I can write my own code to generate and manipulate as well as using standard GUI tools. Is there any "data first" EDA package? Something more "docbook" and less "Microsoft Word"?
At KiCon 2019 there was a presentation on SKiDL which allows you to describe circuits in Python. You can then output a netlist for use in KiCAD's PCB tool (or potentially other EDA tools). I have not tried to use it personally.