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Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

phys.org

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Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#71

Post by matthewdgreen »

rayiner wrote: post #30
leocassarani wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if you're eligible to vote in the UK, vote Labour in the December 12th general election: https://labour.org.uk/manifesto/a-green-industrial-revolutio... Likewise support Green New Deal politicians in the US and elsewhere.

> Likewise support Green New Deal politicians in the US and elsewhere. If we are really trying to avert climate change, how is spending trillions on labor unions and guaranteed jobs going to help? If this was the plot of the movie Armageddon, and there was an asteroid hurtling towards earth, would your planned respond spend pages talking about unions, wealth inequality, indigenous people, and guaranteed healthcare, j…

The logic behind the GND is simple: if we don’t do something about this, we’re going to be screwed. People don’t want to do anything about it because they’re afraid it will cost jobs. So make a plan that guarantees them jobs if they do something about it.

It’s a political solution to a technical problem. You may not like the politics, but it’s pretty damn logical.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#72

Post by imtringued »

LessDmesg wrote: post #61
wayoutthere wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sociological impact will be immense and likely bankrupt most of the world. We're going to have to move people out of low-lying areas in a pretty short amount of time. There will be billions of refugees but the inland areas don't have the infrastructure or water sources to absorb that many people. There will be food shortages as farmable land becomes inundated or dries up. Wars will happen as desperate people / na…

Sounds like fearmongering with no basis. There are lots of areas which would benefit from warming and become food producers (Siberia and Canada come to mind). As for Southeast Asians: they're already used to living on water, with stilt houses, rice terraces etc. Humans can cope, as tgey always have. Overall, there will be more water, more warmth and more civilization.

>Humans can cope

Not if other humans deny the process of "coping".

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#73

Post by imtringued »

ppf wrote: post #37
gorpovitch wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is true that the earth has already been warmer. We're reaching points that humans are never seen, though. Second, the problem here is not only the total temperature variation but the speed at which the temperature is changing. Think of the difference between a car going from 130 km/h to 0 km/h in 8 seconds, and a car going from 130 km/h to 0 km/h in 0.3 seconds. Not really endearing.

Understood, although we have no way to know if there have ever been similar events, as the geologic record is something of a low-pass filter. Just for the sake of argument, let's say you find yourself in a car in the second scenario, with no known way to stop it. What would you do? I say this as a pragmatist - if we take the headlines at face value, and we only have ~10 years to avert a catastrophe, then the only rea…

I'm not sure what the point of suicide is when the worst that can happen as a result of climate change is death.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#74

Post by cmendel »

ppf wrote: post #60
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given a slow enough rate of change, species would adapt and migrate. Presuming there aren't farms, cities, roads, railways, dams and fences preventing smooth migration to the newly appropriate regions. My concern is we're changing the climate at geologically unprecedented rates, likely far too quickly for species to evolve and migrate, even if we hadn't locked up 50% of the world's landmass for our own use. That will…

Fair enough - so how are humans sustainable?

GP's point is that they aren't. We are looking down the barrel of a total ecological collapse, and the trigger has likely already been pulled.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#75

Post by ppf »

imtringued wrote: post #73
ppf wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Understood, although we have no way to know if there have ever been similar events, as the geologic record is something of a low-pass filter. Just for the sake of argument, let's say you find yourself in a car in the second scenario, with no known way to stop it. What would you do? I say this as a pragmatist - if we take the headlines at face value, and we only have ~10 years to avert a catastrophe, then the only rea…

I'm not sure what the point of suicide is when the worst that can happen as a result of climate change is death.

Right, so what should we do?

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#76

Post by ppf »

cmendel wrote: post #74
ppf wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough - so how are humans sustainable?

GP's point is that they aren't. We are looking down the barrel of a total ecological collapse, and the trigger has likely already been pulled.

I tend to agree, I was just curious where this discussion would end up. So, what should we do?

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#77

Post by spodek »

travisoneill1 wrote: post #9

It seems like they are always saying we are on the brink of some "tipping point." Is there an example of any we have already passed?

> Is there an example of any we have already passed?

Reading about nature before humans or where humans settle shows that what passes as nature today is nothing like it used to be. That we are mostly ignorant of it doesn't change that we've passed many tipping points. Each extinction, for example, is irreversible and everyone here knows we're causing more than ever.

I recommend The World Without Us by Alan Weisman (audiobook free on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8z6vsg1OH8) and The Once and Future World by J. B. MacKinnon http://www.jbmackinnon.com/index.html. I recorded a video essay on Once and Future World: http://joshuaspodek.com/your-daily-environment-009-the-once-....

We've crossed tipping point after tipping point. We just don't know what we've lost.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#78

Post by RickJWagner »

" around 10 metres of irreversible sea-level rise. Reducing emissions could slow this process, allowing more time for low-lying populations to move."

This seems like hyperbole to me. I'll be glad to buy Hawaiin real estate (at an appropriate discount, of course) to show my sincerity.

Any sellers?

Seriously, articles of this kind are so over the top that they cause mental fatigue for the issue and de-emphasize climate change.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#79

Post by chatmasta »

RickJWagner wrote: post #78

" around 10 metres of irreversible sea-level rise. Reducing emissions could slow this process, allowing more time for low-lying populations to move." This seems like hyperbole to me. I'll be glad to buy Hawaiin real estate (at an appropriate discount, of course) to show my sincerity. Any sellers? Seriously, articles of this kind are so over the top that they cause mental fatigue for the issue and de-emphasize climate…

President Obama seems to agree with you, as he recently bought a mansion on the beach in Martha’s Vineyard.

It’s hard to take climate alarmism seriously when its proponents are taking actions like that.

Re: Nine climate tipping points now 'active,' warn scientists

#80

Post by dkraft »

ptah wrote: post #70
rayiner wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s an article (he interviews someone) collecting facts from sources that represent the scientific consensus.

not as authoritative as the nature journal article that OP is based on: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-03595-0 it is clearly based on a consensus

Its all crap. "Not as authoritative". What a fool. One of dozens of authoritative Sources: https://www.worldhealth.net/news/science-is-broken-and-the-p...
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