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A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

nytimes.com

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Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#71

Post by sandworm101 »

weaksauce wrote: post #66
sandworm101 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But remember that this is America, where super-natural sentencing is a norm. Prisons are filled with people serving double, triple or "life plus 100 years" sentences. Logic isn't running this show.

The logic there is if the criminal appeals and gets a charge dropped due to a technicality or some other issue then they are still in jail. Not ideal but not without logic.

"Technicality" is a euphemism for "constitutional rights". You don't get out of prison because the cop spelled your name wrong as he booked you. You get out because, in the eyes of the system that sentenced you in the first place, someone steamrolled over rights enshrined at the heart of the American system. Those rights are meaningless if governments may violate them without repercussion. The sum of all the "technicalities" is the thing we call freedom.

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#72

Post by jacurtis »

jeffwass wrote: post #12

Jon Snow used the same logic to get out of the Night’s Watch.

I mean, he was "resurrected". But I guess what is the difference between a witch ressurecting you with a magical force, and a doctor resurrecting you with CPR.

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#73

Post by beerandt »

kornork wrote: post #55

At some point, artificially extended life spans may become feasible and common. It seems to me if/when that happens, a life sentence should be considered cruel and unusual.

That's a hard line to draw, when including things like drug overdoses, hunger strikes or suicide.

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#74

Post by Nextgrid »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #49
bdcravens wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if he doesn't get release, I think he will have grounds for a substantial financial judgment. Obviously that's not very useful in prison.

Pretty sure money is useful in prison.

Can you legally access & use money in prison, and what would you buy?

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#75

Post by [deleted] »

aaomidi wrote: post #65
sandworm101 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But remember that this is America, where super-natural sentencing is a norm. Prisons are filled with people serving double, triple or "life plus 100 years" sentences. Logic isn't running this show.

I honestly think there's nothing more disgusting than imprisoning someone. I've actually made this argument in my social sciences class that the reason prison sentences are so long is that people generally thought/think the afterlife exists. It's easy to take away an individuals right to life when you think there's going to be another one in another life. I would personally much rather have the death penalty than any…

[deleted]

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#76

Post by beerandt »

Markoff wrote: post #62

if he was serving only one life sentence and had DNR order, then it's fair to say he served his sentence if they resuscitated him against his will if he would be serving multiple life sentences than he would just fulfill first one, otherwise what's the purpose of multiple life sentences in US? we don't have this nonsense in Europe

>what's the purpose of multiple life sentences in US

To compensate for what was perceived to be an overly sympathetic appeals system.

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#77

Post by beerandt »

technothrasher wrote: post #9
bleh123 wrote: post #2

I'm not fully convinced the courts got this one completely right. This is a very interesting legal argument and lays emphasis on the need for legislators to express their intentions in writing more fully as opposed to writing laws with such loose and widely applicable terms such as "Life" without giving the term or their intent in using it more context. If, as the Judge argues, that "he did not legally die as his pre…

Point 2 is where this man's argument falls apart. The medically accepted definition of death is the permanent, irreversible cessation of 1) the circulatory system, 2) the respiratory system, and 3) cerebral function. Just having your heart stop is not "death" and hasn't been for a very long time. That definition only hangs around these days colloquially for people to enhance the drama of their medical stories. Oh, an…

Also, many of those said rights are forfeited upon conviction, especially while still in the legal custody of the state.

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#78

Post by bdcravens »

GhettoMaestro wrote: post #50
bdcravens wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if he doesn't get release, I think he will have grounds for a substantial financial judgment. Obviously that's not very useful in prison.

On what grounds? He is serving a life sentence. He is in the custody of the correctional facility. They have every duty to keep him alive and healthy, up to the point of him expiring naturally. Ridiculous logic games like this are a pretty good reason why excessive legalese is mocked in mainstream culture - because it is totally disconnected from reality and enthralled with their own existence.

In most incarcerated settings, you are allowed to refuse treatment (barring a court order).

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#79

Post by bryanrasmussen »

Nextgrid wrote: post #74
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure money is useful in prison.

Can you legally access & use money in prison, and what would you buy?

first, as this is an American prison you will probably want to be using the money on your accounts to buy food that to eat instead of depending on the often inedible, non-nutritious stuff that is available from the prison kitchen.

second, it's quite a well known scandal regarding how systems are set up to rip off inmates for phone services https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/news/2015/jul/31/inside-shad... so if you are a prisoner with money that is nice that you can actually call people when you want as long as you want.

third, depending on where you are at the commissary probably has other things you want, and if you have enough of those things you can trade that for other things inside that you might want.

(of course you do not legally access the money, it is on an account that you can use, you can also - although the process can be convoluted - release money to visitors and those visitors could give it to other people who are related or confederates of other people inside allowing you to buy other things that way [which is of course going to be against the rules])

I could go on, but I find the question somewhat weird - I'm guessing you must be from a country with no knowledge of American pop-culture or anything because this is quite a bit past even 10000 territory https://www.xkcd.com/1053/

on edit: reference article for bad American prison food https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/ezq59z/what-its-like-to-e...

Re: A Prisoner Who Briefly Died Argues That He’s Served His Life Sentence

#80

Post by jaffau »

aaomidi wrote: post #65
sandworm101 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But remember that this is America, where super-natural sentencing is a norm. Prisons are filled with people serving double, triple or "life plus 100 years" sentences. Logic isn't running this show.

I honestly think there's nothing more disgusting than imprisoning someone. I've actually made this argument in my social sciences class that the reason prison sentences are so long is that people generally thought/think the afterlife exists. It's easy to take away an individuals right to life when you think there's going to be another one in another life. I would personally much rather have the death penalty than any…

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