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OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

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Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#71
post #18

I really like this list, but believe it's wrongly titled. I'm a nuclear engineer, who pretty much just writes modelling software all day. The software architecture stuff is something I've never been taught and always felt would be immensely valuable to learn. Some good resources for that on this list. Also a request for any resources of scientists trying to get their head around how to write good software, we're all…

That is basically the mission statement of Software Carpentry ( https://software-carpentry.org/ ). They have a _ton_ of great material for those in scientific computing wanting to improve their software engineering skills.

I've looked into software carpentry, I'm glad it's there but learning how to commit and 'intro to ' is about five years behind what I need. Most scientists can read intro tutorials themselves. I'll keep looking around on their website though, thanks for sharing.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#72
As someone who has lived through a big chunk of the 'computer science' lifecycle arc :-) My perspective is a bit different here.

"Programming", or the skill of writing specifications that can be translated via software into product has come a long way from the 60's to the present day. People I meet, interview, and work with, often fall into three broad chunks of the spectrum.

At one end there are 'coders', who are essentially cooks, they take previously written code, adapt it to their requirements, attach it to third party libraries and ship the end result. They have been essential to the boom in Internet companies for decades because they ship a lot of code and they are relatively inexpensive (with respect to the expected generated revenue) to hire. When their code doesn't work as they expect they generally iterate on it using other suggested solutions until they arrive at one that operates the way they need/want it to.

In the middle are 'engineers' who build more at the system level and can fill in the gaps with third party software when needed but are also fully capable of generating the required capability starting with a blank screen. When the system doesn't work they expect they can analyze it from first principles to get to the root cause of the problem.

At the other end are 'scientists' who think about the problems of the nature of computing. These folks rewrite an algorithm in three different ways to understand how different compute architectures might execute it. Driven by the joy of discovering new insights about how computers work, if something they build doesn't work they are delighted because it has illuminated a gap in their understanding that can be productively filled.

Different educational settings are useful for addressing the goals of the student, and in my experience those goals will be different depending on where on the spectrum of 'programmer' they see themselves.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#73
post #70
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 50/50 on this. Part of me really agrees with you -- you need time and practice and mistakes to learn this stuff. But also, I'm not sure it has to be wall clock time. Four years at university gets you breadth that is probably good for you as a human, and probably important for contextualizing your work as an engineer (oh hey, history might be a valuable lesson for your understanding of ethics. Art and literature m…

The 4 years of college includes a lot of non-college time during summers, breaks, holiday vacations, etc. There is no reason why a serious student shouldn't be actively learning 50 weeks a year, minus holidays, and putting in the same work time as his peers who entered the job market after high school. In which case, 3 years is easily enough. However, 3 * 50 * 40 is only 6000 hours, which won't make you an expert. Th…

> There is no reason why a serious student shouldn't be actively learning 50 weeks a year

Except... being a human? Having a family? Decompressing from the stress of studying? Earning a living? (I worked 35 hours a week in school so I could eat...)

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#75

This has some good courses, but in general seems overly long and is of inconsistent quality. As an alternative, https://teachyourselfcs.com/ is a curriculum from the folks at Bradfield, but it's narrowly focused on core CS concepts/topics.

The big problem with projects like this is the quality is pretty much lacking. Most of those MOOCs to begin with are no way intended to replace the equivalent college class. Most of them are watered down introductions to the courses. At a baseline for me to take any MOOC seriously then I want to see a high-quality textbook (or equivalent) for the course. If that doesn't exist then my opinion is the course is likely t…

Quality of MOOCs varies a lot. The edX ones tend to be more like regular college courses if you are selective. Coursera and Udacity are more MOOC-specific courses.

Even within edX, the quality varies a lot. The Harvard introductory course is really for non-CS majors and would be a waste of time for CS majors. The MIT course is for CS majors.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

High school drop out turned software engineer here. I never had any success with these sort of programs. My advice is pick a hard problem (to you) and stick with it until you've solved it. Rinse and repeat. Eventually you will be pretty good at solving problems.

same background, but different advice: pick a problem you have and build a website that solves it. start with a trivial problem, then start adding javascript.

No need to limit yourself to websites. Embedded systems are fun too. Although I guess you could put a website on one of those too.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#77
post #2

This is a bit hypocritical coming from a self-taught dropout, but I have kind of grown to dislike a lot of these "learn programming on your own!" things/bootcamps/courses. This isn't because of some idea that it's bad to learn programming for fun, but more that I think it's kind of reductive to try and squeeze things down to a streamlined lesson to begin with...There's a reason college takes four or more years; it ta…

I agree, there have been concerns about the lack of humanities courses in tech schools. College gives you a broad education, the opportunity to take courses in fields you want to dabble in, meet people from disparate backgrounds. It's hard to ever do that again in your life. The bootcamps are just serving the mad rush to get into tech. The courses - serve a purpose, you build on your fundamentals.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#78

why doesnt this exist for any other field? you never hear of a DIY mathematician or economist...further proves that tech is a trade not a profession

All it means is that the software engineering sector is more open to applicants with varying backgrounds. This shouldn't come as a surprise, given how relatively young and innovative the tech industry is. There's nothing stopping someone from getting textbooks and learning the fundamentals to be a mathematician or economist, what stops that from getting them a job is the industry not being open to that. The different…

It also depends on the culture of teaching. In econ and, to a certain extent, in comp sci the stuff occurring within universities is very different from what students of those subjects do when they leave.

And, imo, this is actually due to the popularity of the underlying subject. Both econ and comp sci are popular because of what you can do when you leave uni but this means more funding for those inside uni. This funding seems to go into producing more arcane research and increasing the complexity of the subject (not knowledge, just complexity).

Mathematics doesn't do this. The practical and the abstract are clearly demarcated. If you are studying to go onto research, there are usually specific courses. If you just need to know calc, there are different ones.

It isn't healthy when this distinction isn't clear. Economics has suffered massively from being very abstract. Comp sci is probably going the same way. And I think in both cases more effort needs to go into making the knowledge more accessible.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#79

If this is self taught then calculus shouldn't be core. It should be moved to advanced math and replaced by more linear algebra. Calculus is a beautiful course but linear algebra is central to data science and ai. Unless you're getting into topics that require it, 3 semesters of calculus will go unused. You can't know too much linear algebra and discrete math.

always contentious :)

I think you need both, I know in my areas of measuring things and controlling things it is useful. Though I'd struggle to say how useful.

I think we can all nitpick any given course, but as it is, it seems reasonable, and I'm sure they will tweak it over time based on feedback from students

I think it's generally good. If you did all the course, you'd be in a good position to tackle a lot of programmnig problems.

Re: OSSU: A path to a free self-taught education in computer science

#80
post #2

This is a bit hypocritical coming from a self-taught dropout, but I have kind of grown to dislike a lot of these "learn programming on your own!" things/bootcamps/courses. This isn't because of some idea that it's bad to learn programming for fun, but more that I think it's kind of reductive to try and squeeze things down to a streamlined lesson to begin with...There's a reason college takes four or more years; it ta…

I disagree with you in one regard, I think you are taking the position of a young person who hasn't had much education outside of high school. Take a look at it from the perspective of a 30 or 40-something with some college or a degree in another domain looking to transition into CS. In this case, the fact that formal CS degrees are, I dare say, polluted, with irrelevant crap is a waste of time, money and brain power…

Wait, so you only want him to learn about successful political ideologies?
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