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US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

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Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#71

Post by wolf550e »

meddlepal wrote: post #60

> and that many were fatigued, with an average of 4.9 hours of sleep between the 14 crew members present. I suspect this played more of a role than any of the controls or procedures did. I had a friend in the Navy and he once explained the shifts he did to me and how utterly insane they were. I suspect leadership doesn't want to (or cant) fix the root cause (fatigue) and is happy to spend tax dollars to replace the s…

We have an example of how navy shifts work on HN by 'genkimind: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19101464

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#72

Post by HomeDeLaPot »

jakear wrote: post #5
rossdavidh wrote: post #2

You know, I think touchscreens are not preferable unless you need/want to be able to have controls for many different systems in the same space (e.g. a smartphone with multiple apps). If you are needing a dedicated control for a high-stakes system, the fact that it's a more modern-looking interface should not matter. Touchscreens are inherently inferior to a mechanical interface, if it's a single-system (i.e. doesn't…

This is why I detest touchscreens for most car functions. Specifically AC, with old fashioned knobs I have full control over AC without taking my eyes off the road, but nowadays everyone wants to put it on their infotainment system, hidden beneath 4 other buttons.

Absolutely agree. Controls with tactile feedback are literally lifesavers when you're trying to pay attention to the road. Touchscreens are cool, but all the basic controls should be presented as neat panels of knobs and buttons that don't require so much as a glance to operate.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#73

Post by andybak »

Someone1234 wrote: post #55
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like you're making some very false choices between smarts/voice compatibility and physical controls. Physical buttons and dials for users to interact with that still can be changed by the system are wholly possible. For instance, a rocker switch that sits in the middle can be used to issue on and off commands, while being separate from say, a status light that lets you know whether the device is on or off. Whi…

> Physical buttons and dials for users to interact with that still can be changed by the system are wholly possible. Sure, but irrational. One of the largest benefits of physical controls is physical feedback, like being about to feel if you've reached the max cold/hot ceilings or the state of the switches. To make them voice compatible you have to remove that physical association (e.g. infinite spinners, or blind sw…

I think all of these things are solvable by haptics and good design.

Of course - the latter is the factor least likely to be present.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#74

Post by jaclaz »

liability wrote: post #37
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question: Why don't modern cars yet monitor humidity in and outside the car and make the correct decisions to keep your windows clear? Why are we focusing on self-driving cars while our cars are too dumb to do this much on their own?

Because when the sensor goes screwy I don't want my car to start flipping shit like the defroster on when it's not needed? Because manual controls make such automation totally unnecessary? Because even if the automated system were designed to be "fail safe", the state that's 'safe' is actually context dependent, therefore manual controls will be necessary anyway? It ain't broke, so stop trying to 'fix' it.

>It ain't broke, so stop trying to 'fix' it.

Sure, but the marketing department had to fill a few blanks in the "bad weather options pack" (optional but casually installed on all cars in production that will be available in the next six-eight months) for a mere US$ 3,000:

1) self-learning wipers (using AI to set automatically an appropriate wiping speed, including economode, that only wipes the right side of the windscreen when you make a free turn on right at a traffic light)

2) intelligent defrost (computing the correct defrost temperature through analysis of real-time satellite heat maps)

3) heated and ventilated mats (that can dry your wet shoes and lower half of trousers independently from heating/confitioning settings)

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#75

Post by blackflame7000 »

mhandley wrote: post #18
jakear wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I detest touchscreens for most car functions. Specifically AC, with old fashioned knobs I have full control over AC without taking my eyes off the road, but nowadays everyone wants to put it on their infotainment system, hidden beneath 4 other buttons.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#76

Post by vinay427 »

blackflame7000 wrote: post #75
mhandley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

This depends on the state/region. There's no universal standard in the US, and some states definitely don't require the operation of all of these controls before the test.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#77

Post by bobthepanda »

blackflame7000 wrote: post #75
mhandley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

This was not my experience in New York. You don’t have to demonstrate anything other than knowledge of where the turn signal, ignition, brake and gas pedal are.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#78

Post by goatinaboat »

twic wrote: post #45
mhandley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

Honest question: why didn't you take the train? This would have been a good time to take another sip of your whisky and soda.

On Friday this happened https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49300025

British trains are very expensive and unreliable at the best of times. Anyone who can drive, does.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#79

Post by c22 »

blackflame7000 wrote: post #75
mhandley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I was driving back from Scotland to England, doing 70ish, when we ran into a really heavy thunderstorm. Went from good visibility to almost zero in seconds, and the only thing I could properly see was the crash barrier alongside the lane. I found myself desperately trying to see where the road was, simultaneously trying not to get rear-ended as I slowed up, switch on the rear fog lamps and hazards, max wipe…

You know, when you take your drivers test in the US, you have to demonstrate your ability to know where all those functions are before you even pull away to start your test.

I took a driver's test 3 years ago and this was not included.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#80

Post by Kapura »

rossdavidh wrote: post #2

You know, I think touchscreens are not preferable unless you need/want to be able to have controls for many different systems in the same space (e.g. a smartphone with multiple apps). If you are needing a dedicated control for a high-stakes system, the fact that it's a more modern-looking interface should not matter. Touchscreens are inherently inferior to a mechanical interface, if it's a single-system (i.e. doesn't…

This is absolutely correct. Humans are physical creatures living in a physical world and our brains have evolved to interact with that world in a physical way. Touch-screen interfaces, even good ones, necessitate a level of mental abstraction, which is going to make operating in a fatigued state even more difficult.
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