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A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

nytimes.com

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Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#71

Post by Scarblac »

teekert wrote: post #62
tdons wrote: post #58

Don't think of this as dropping your kids in say, the High Sierras or Death Valley ;-) This is actually an extremely safe thing, nothing much can go wrong. Some supporting facts: Our entire country (The Netherlands) measures roughly 161mi by 93mi and is densely populated. There's always a dwelling nearby. Consequently it's impossible to get really lost. We also have no natural dangers to speak of, no deadly animals,…

I think it is important to say this indeed. I also did "dropping" as a kid, and later with kids, but the only thing that "spoiled it" was cheaters that find a phone in 1 hour and call a cab. I haven't heard It being done for a while now, is it still a thing in this time of fear and smartphones?

Yes, their own phones are confiscated (for most of the camp).

TBH last time we did one each group just had one adult with them, they'd just stay silent the whole time and follow along. So it was a bit boring. But we did that because we only had a few people and one car, and couldn't keep track of the whereabouts of the groups otherwise.

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#72

Post by cylinder »

tiku wrote: post #6

The Dutch woods are not very big and not very far from the cities. You could get lost but you can always hear the highways and there is cell coverage everywhere. And the most scary thing you could come across is a wild boar, there are no dangerous animals. There were 2 or 3 wolf sightings the past 2 years, but they stay away from noise. Anyway I think Dutch kids are balsy enough to scare any wolf away. (Or a human pr…

Just curious, does this density across all of the country lead to a desire amongst Dutch people to find true wilderness every once and a while? For example travelling to remote national parks in the US or Australia/NZ? Or does it lead to people preferring built environments and feeling anxious in true wilderness?

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#73

Post by gambiting »

scurvy wrote: post #30
tiku wrote: post #6

The Dutch woods are not very big and not very far from the cities. You could get lost but you can always hear the highways and there is cell coverage everywhere. And the most scary thing you could come across is a wild boar, there are no dangerous animals. There were 2 or 3 wolf sightings the past 2 years, but they stay away from noise. Anyway I think Dutch kids are balsy enough to scare any wolf away. (Or a human pr…

Are Euro wild boars not dangerous? So much for that Black Forest Ham premium! Boars definitely attack people in the US, and the wounds can be bad to the lower body and gut. Lots of blood loss isn't uncommon.

We have them in Poland and from my own childhood spent around Polish forest I remember the rule being - if it's a single boar, you have good chances trying to scare it away, but if it's a mother with the young......make for the nearest tree and climb like your life depended on it(because she will attack you).

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#74

Post by Scarblac »

jacquesm wrote: post #56
scurvy wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Euro wild boars not dangerous? So much for that Black Forest Ham premium! Boars definitely attack people in the US, and the wounds can be bad to the lower body and gut. Lots of blood loss isn't uncommon.

They are, they are found in France, Germany, Belgium and Poland in the wild. Haven't seen or heard from any in NL but there is a good chance we have some here as well. Don't get between mommy and the cute little ones.

There are lots in the Netherlands, around the Veluwe they are a bit of a plague animal, ploughing up gardens et cetera.

But groups of kids on a dropping are very noisy, they don't get to see any.

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#75

Post by photonios »

jacquesm wrote: post #55
tiku wrote: post #6

The Dutch woods are not very big and not very far from the cities. You could get lost but you can always hear the highways and there is cell coverage everywhere. And the most scary thing you could come across is a wild boar, there are no dangerous animals. There were 2 or 3 wolf sightings the past 2 years, but they stay away from noise. Anyway I think Dutch kids are balsy enough to scare any wolf away. (Or a human pr…

Back when I was a kid, at the ripe old age of 12, we did this at the Hoge Veluwe, and I can assure you that there were no highways in hearing distance and we didn't have cellphones yet. It was also a pretty good experience, if a little cold.

The Hoge Veluwe might be one of the few places where this can happen. And even then, the Hoge Veluwe is 55 sqkm. Worst case scenario you walk for a few hours to reach one of the edges. Just keep walking in the same direction.

Hoge Veluwe, one of the few things I miss from my home town. Such a great place to hang out as a kid.

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#76

Post by Scarblac »

throw20102010 wrote: post #2

“with only a primitive GPS to indicate the right direction” ... so these kids are more at risk of being kidnapped than they are of getting lost. I’ll admit that I think it’s a bit weird to make kids walk home in the night, but the author does a terrible job of making it sound suspenseful. This activity has gotten a lot safer since GPS became widespread. I kind of feel bad for anyone that went through this in the 80’s…

Current Scout leader here.

In the 80s we were sent out to knock on farmer's doors to ask for a place to sleep, and we did it just over the German border so we had to ask in a foreign language too. I actually want to reintroduce that (but farms have fewer places fit for a few sleeping bags).

The fact they are in groups makes it super safe anyway.

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#77

Post by neals »

ddnb wrote: post #64
tdons wrote: post #58

Don't think of this as dropping your kids in say, the High Sierras or Death Valley ;-) This is actually an extremely safe thing, nothing much can go wrong. Some supporting facts: Our entire country (The Netherlands) measures roughly 161mi by 93mi and is densely populated. There's always a dwelling nearby. Consequently it's impossible to get really lost. We also have no natural dangers to speak of, no deadly animals,…

>> (we don't have mountains). Woah, you forgot about the Vaalserberg?

Also, what about that boterberg I used to hear about?

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#78

Post by merijnv »

ddnb wrote: post #64
tdons wrote: post #58

Don't think of this as dropping your kids in say, the High Sierras or Death Valley ;-) This is actually an extremely safe thing, nothing much can go wrong. Some supporting facts: Our entire country (The Netherlands) measures roughly 161mi by 93mi and is densely populated. There's always a dwelling nearby. Consequently it's impossible to get really lost. We also have no natural dangers to speak of, no deadly animals,…

>> (we don't have mountains). Woah, you forgot about the Vaalserberg?

Technically not a mountain, since mountains start at >500m and Vaalserberg is only 322m high...

On the other hand, we do (technically) have mountains, as Saba has Mount Scenery (887m) and Sint Eustatius has The Quill ( 601m)...

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#79

Post by teekert »

Scarblac wrote: post #71
teekert wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is important to say this indeed. I also did "dropping" as a kid, and later with kids, but the only thing that "spoiled it" was cheaters that find a phone in 1 hour and call a cab. I haven't heard It being done for a while now, is it still a thing in this time of fear and smartphones?

Yes, their own phones are confiscated (for most of the camp). TBH last time we did one each group just had one adult with them, they'd just stay silent the whole time and follow along. So it was a bit boring. But we did that because we only had a few people and one car, and couldn't keep track of the whereabouts of the groups otherwise.

Well, I can understand that, it depends on the age of the children also.

Re: A Peculiarly Dutch Summer Rite: Children Abandoned in the Night Woods

#80

Post by tom_mellior »

photonios wrote: post #75
jacquesm wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Back when I was a kid, at the ripe old age of 12, we did this at the Hoge Veluwe, and I can assure you that there were no highways in hearing distance and we didn't have cellphones yet. It was also a pretty good experience, if a little cold.

The Hoge Veluwe might be one of the few places where this can happen. And even then, the Hoge Veluwe is 55 sqkm. Worst case scenario you walk for a few hours to reach one of the edges. Just keep walking in the same direction. Hoge Veluwe, one of the few things I miss from my home town. Such a great place to hang out as a kid.

> Just keep walking in the same direction.

AFAIK this is surprisingly difficult, many (most? all?) people end up walking in circles when placed in a forest without any clues for orientation.

Edit: Some random sources: https://www.livescience.com/33431-why-humans-walk-circles.ht..., https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2009/08/why-we-walk-circles, https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(09)...

"participants repeatedly walked in circles when they could not see the sun ... participants walked in often surprisingly small circles (diameter < 20 m), though rarely in a systematic direction"

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