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Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

businessinsider.com

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Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. The app makes it much more difficult for women to subvert the oppression. Before the app the government used little paper slips to grant travel permission, now the "guardians" get SMS notifications when a woman's passport is scanned.

So, how will getting rid of an app stop the SMS notification system?

How will getting rid of the technology that makes this possible stop it?

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#72

They let you download the app... but they do NOT host the service. That's run by the Ministry of Interior. EDIT: I had a paragraph below this saying the laws were really the problem and would still exist without the app.. but I forgot one key point: how easy it was to subvert the system before the app existed. I've removed that section. I fully support removing the app from the app stores and forcing SA to go back to…

The app binary is hosted for download on Apple’s CDN. I don’t know about Google, but it’s a safe assumption it works that way with Google too.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#74
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great idea. But outside of this would anyone be interested in meeting up at tech companies and protesting?

For what? So Apple removes the app from the store. Does that materially impact Saudi Arabi's institutional oppression of women?

Yes. Creating safe spaces for slavery and oppression is not what the App Store should be doing. It may not seem like much but every bit helps.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#75
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here, I didn't realize that Saudi Arabia was a huge investor. That sickens me.

Don't worry, they own some Lyft too.

Less, though. So Lyft it is. Not that there’s really any way you can ever control who owns shares of a public company, but if the government or its proxy is on record as a large shareholder, that’s something.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. The app makes it much more difficult for women to subvert the oppression. Before the app the government used little paper slips to grant travel permission, now the "guardians" get SMS notifications when a woman's passport is scanned.

So, how will getting rid of an app stop the SMS notification system?

I’m not advocating that anybody DDOS their SMS system with fake alerts. But at least an app protects against that to a greater degree than an SMS solution. The app creates a safe space for oppression.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#77

I can’t believe that Lyft doesn’t cover the Bay Area with billboards that say “Saudi Arabia beats women and owns 10% of Uber.” “Saudi Arabia murders gay people and owns 10% of Uber.” “Saudi Arabia crucified two people last year and owns 10% of Uber.”

They can't because Saudi Arabia also owns part of Lyft (2.3%): https://www.reuters.com/article/lyft-kingdom-holding-ma/saud...

That's a 7.7% delta. If there was a 7.7% price delta then people would opt for Lyft every time.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#79
A pragmatic view:

70% of the mobile devices in Saudi Arabia run Android.

Outcome 1- Apple bans Absher but Google does not. Absher usage continues. Android gains market share over time.

Outcome 2- Apple and Google both ban Absher. Android users install it via sideload from the government website. Carriers preload the sideloaded Absher app onto new phones. Absher usage continues. Android market share grows over time.

I don't see a victory here other than taking a moral stance.

Re: Apple, Google criticised for Saudi Absher app that tracks women

#80
post #11

"Apple and Google accused of hosting Saudi gov't app that tracks women " is a weird phrasing. It's absolutely, 100% verifiably true they host it, as the article plainly states: > Both Google Play and iTunes host Absher, a government web service that allows men to specify when and how women can cross Saudi borders, and to get close to real-time SMS updates when they travel.

Kind of beside the point, too. The bigger news and greater surprise is that the Saudis have an app to track & apprehend women who try to leave! Like "What an outrage that Google hosts this" isn't quiiite what I was thinking...
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