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IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

discuss.haiku-os.org

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Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#71

Post by repolfx »

pjmlp wrote: post #61
mhd wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's always been some leeway in that. Both the original Mac OS and Windows had a variety of languages targeting it, but they tended to strive towards emulating the core SDK experience (if they weren't a wrapper around it). Unix had it different with there being no core experience in the first place -- X11 being a glorified terminal multiplexer plus xeyes. Whether it was the commercial Unices with OpenLook/NeWS vs…

Hence the opinion Steve Jobs had about UNIX, NeXTSTEP's POSIX support being more geared towards bringing software in and win DoD contracts than anything else. I don't need such vision, it is how it would look like if all OSes happen to jungle browser instances, ChromeOS style, while a big chunk of applications runs on someone else's computer, abstracted via language runtimes. The return to mainframe's timesharing day…

It's not a pretty vision of the future but maybe there are ways to escape it.

The reason apps all went cross platform is that desktop operating systems stopped innovating. Which is the desktop platform with the most new native apps, where developers take pride in making non-cross platform experiences? MacOS for sure. Which desktop OS has been consistently the most innovative over the past 20 years? MacOS!

Haiku running IntelliJ is technically interesting, but ultimately as a user I don't understand why I'd want to use Haiku. BeOS may have been innovative 20 years ago but it's a dead OS that hasn't changed in decades. May as well run IntelliJ on any other platform, then.

I think the desktop can be great again, but it will take a new generation of developers with new ideas about where to take operating system technology. I also tend to think that whoever tackles that problem will probably tackle it by writing a cross-platform app runtime that slowly expands to become more and more of an operating system until the actual OS is indeed, just relegated to providing some drivers and bootstrap code. But the actual UX will be defined entirely by that environment. Sort of like how Pharo gives you a full blown desktop environment when you start it (but I'm not arguing for Smalltalk)..

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#72

Post by tracker1 »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #63
orionblastar wrote: post #43

Haiku is progressing great. Anyone heard of AROS which is a rewrite of AmigaOS? I try to keep up with free and open source Windows alternatives for the PC. We need something that even senior citizens can use to replace Windows XP on a system they can't afford to upgrade. Just the basic word processing Internet surfing and email. ReactOS is progressing as well. OSFree the OS/2 rewrite seems slower but using the M4 ker…

> We need something that even senior citizens can use to replace Windows XP on a system they can't afford to upgrade. Just the basic word processing Internet surfing and email. I am probably one of the biggest naysayers of Linux as a desktop platform, so keep that in mind when I ask: What's wrong with Linux for this use case? If all you need is an internet kiosk, Linux is fine. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that's…

One of my grandmothers (until she passed) was on linux for about 8 years. I'd update/upgrade about every year or so. It ran chrome, and Wine ran the couple of windows 95 era games she used.

My other grandmother has been on Chome OS for almost as long. Which has been another great option. I do wish that Google had better support for installing/running full Chrome OS on more generic hardware. I find it's just about the best option all around for the novice computer user.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#73

Post by tqh »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #60
chaz6 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can now run your development tools on Haiku, what would it take to make Haiku a server platform for running your server-side applications?

Hopefully not, it's better they focus on doing one thing well.

We only have plans for a desktop OS.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#74

Post by tracker1 »

raitucarp wrote: post #14

Awesome. But, I suggest Haiku people need hire ui/ux for their default theme/window. It will sure attract more user to try this OS as alternative.

While I am not too big on Haiku's aesthetic, and agree that it could use some modernization. I think the earlier focus should be on supporting some more of the underlying platforms that could get more software running on the system.

I think if they could get patches upstream for chrome and node, which would allow electron, that could open the doors for a significant increase in usable end user applications. The article's demonstration on progress for Java applications is very impressive on its' own.

Aside: being able to use user tweaked UI/UX would be nice in general, but would probably be a break from the BeOS origins. I used to run a shell replacement on Win2k and XP era, but I liked win7 so much I stopped using it (don't even recall the name right now).

In the end, there's no cause for rudeness here. While I don't think I'd be able to use Haiku currently, it's nice to see progress here. I'd also be interested to see a window manager for linux that followed the Be/Haiku aesthetics as I think a lot of people would appreciate it. Personally I really like the dock/taskbar in Win7 and 10, though I prefer the Win7 start menu. I run mac, windows and linux regularly (mac and windows daily, linux at least once a week on elementary).

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#75

Post by rollcat »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #31
scroot wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The BeOS and Platinum interfaces are among the best ever created

It’s crazy to me that there are no Linux DEs dedicated to creating a faithful reproduction of the Platinum era Mac desktop. One can configure XFCE or MATE to get something vaguely similar, but it’s really not the same. Would like to try my hand at building something like that myself, but X on top of being phased out is a strange beast to learn and there’s practically no material on writing something for Wayland.

> Would like to try my hand at building something like that myself, but X on top of being phased out is a strange beast to learn and there’s practically no material on writing something for Wayland.

You should look up the work of Sir_Cmpwn (aka Drew DeVault), specifically the wlroots project and his excellent writeup: https://drewdevault.com/2018/07/29/Wayland-shells.html

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#76

Post by zapzupnz »

mhd wrote: post #59
zapzupnz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think macOS/Mac OS X was always known for fantastic Mac-specific software as opposed to just ports of user apps from, say, Linux — probably because Mac OS X was the successor to Mac OS 9. So Mac OS X inherited one userbase that appreciated platform-specific software. Haiku doesn't really have anything to inherit like that so until people start making Haiku-specific software, that could be an issue for seeing great…

In the beginning, there was also a good deal of people coming from NeXt and finally finding a target audience. Some of those applications fared even better, as they were basically Cocoa already, whereas some of the older Mac apps were more baroque, not supporting all the nice new features and having a more outdated look. So the "newcomers" served as important style guides. (Let's not even mention the backlash against…

That's a great point. A lot of the best macOS software came from, and still come from, developers from the NeXTSTEP era. Some have faded a bit, but they're still there setting the benchmark.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#77

Post by orionblastar »

ziotom78 wrote: post #48
orionblastar wrote: post #43

Haiku is progressing great. Anyone heard of AROS which is a rewrite of AmigaOS? I try to keep up with free and open source Windows alternatives for the PC. We need something that even senior citizens can use to replace Windows XP on a system they can't afford to upgrade. Just the basic word processing Internet surfing and email. ReactOS is progressing as well. OSFree the OS/2 rewrite seems slower but using the M4 ker…

It's been a long time since I heard of OSFree. Is it still active?

I think they had a server crash and moved to a new host.

http://osfree.org/

They have something that boots, but I am not sure if it can run OS/2, DOS, Windows code yet.

I wanted to donate $5 but their donate button is broken.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#78

Post by orionblastar »

dingdingdang wrote: post #50
orionblastar wrote: post #43

Haiku is progressing great. Anyone heard of AROS which is a rewrite of AmigaOS? I try to keep up with free and open source Windows alternatives for the PC. We need something that even senior citizens can use to replace Windows XP on a system they can't afford to upgrade. Just the basic word processing Internet surfing and email. ReactOS is progressing as well. OSFree the OS/2 rewrite seems slower but using the M4 ker…

> We need something that even senior citizens can use to replace Windows XP on a system they can't afford to upgrade. My personal experience from large scale transition from Windows 7 to Linux Mint at work indicates that people ABSOLUTELY can use Linux - the UI is (unlike Win10) stable and things do not move around, settings don't change themselves on upgrades. And, importantly, updates can be set to be silent and au…

My father used Linux on a Live-CD when his XP had issues. He used to work at AT&T so he knew how Unix works.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#79

Post by ec109685 »

gecko wrote: post #57
chaz6 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can now run your development tools on Haiku, what would it take to make Haiku a server platform for running your server-side applications?

Haiku is a single-user system, so effectively any privilege escalation gets you root. That's enough right there for me to keep it off a server.

Isn’t the definition of privilege escalation going from non-root to root or did you mean that any RCE on an application gets you root.

Nit picking comment aside, I wonder if the fact that it is single-user was one of the reasons Apple did not go with it.

Re: IntelliJ IDEA and PyCharm Running on Haiku

#80

Post by raitucarp »

Klover wrote: post #24
raitucarp wrote: post #14

Awesome. But, I suggest Haiku people need hire ui/ux for their default theme/window. It will sure attract more user to try this OS as alternative.

So I know dang watches the content of comments to see if they’re up to the guidelines, but does dang also look at excessive downvotes? The comment here is greyed out, something that should only be reserved for highly offensive comments. Which this is not...

Yes, I wonder why they down-vote my comment
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