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The Weight I Carry

theatlantic.com

71–80 of 141 posts

Re: The Weight I Carry

#71
post #9
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work Definitely disagree here. These are the only things that work. How else can you lose weight other than by moving more and eating less?

The key is that people actually don't eat less. They feel more hungry when they exercise, which drives them to eat more , which pushes the vicious cycle even further.

Why are you evaluating the effects of eating less by looking at people who aren't eating less?

Re: The Weight I Carry

#72
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key is that people actually don't eat less. They feel more hungry when they exercise, which drives them to eat more , which pushes the vicious cycle even further.

Why are you evaluating the effects of eating less by looking at people who aren't eating less?

The point is that for most people "exercise and eat less" doesn't happen. Most people are undisciplined and unable to achieve it.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how long did it take you to go into ketosis - im on day 10 and still havnt not gone in (im not really overweight)

Rule of thumb (Keto for mostly 15+ yrs, from 300lbs to 180) is 2-3 days, and at least Atkins version is those 2-3 days at "Being in ketosis" is hard to track; the urine test strips are helpful but not always accurate. Someone came up with a breath analyzer at some point but I lost track of the project. Some recent stuff has shown that a 24-36hr fast can "kick start" ketosis as well; anecdotally it seems to work for m…

The breath analyzer that is being hyped right now is called Keyto. You can also get blood testers and prick your finger.

I don't track myself being in ketosis on a daily basis, but I can definitely tell if I go over based on how I feel.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#74
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think exercise for weight loss/management isn't going to be a good idea for the vast majority of people. As you said, you get hungrier when you burn those calories and it's very easy to spend five minutes and eat all the calories you burned working out for an hour.

When I exercise, it puts me on a health-minded path every day that snowballs into other good decisions. It's like how they say making your bed in the morning helps put you on task the rest of the day. I find your line of thought unconvincing. The thing in common among everyone I know who is overweight is that they don't even work out at all. The amount of people I know who don't do anything is astonishing. The proble…

I think you're on the right track, but you have to account for the biases in the fat people who need this advice. No amount of exercise can counteract overeating at the scale seriously fat people (like past versions of myself) do.

Often weight is _the_ barrier to exercise. When I was at 300lb it was physically painful to walk more than a few minutes. The small muscles near my ankles just couldn't take it.

After I lost ~25lbs I suddenly could walk without serious trouble. I'm still working on actual exercise beyond walking 30 minutes to and from work each day.

You can use it as an excuse but really I suspect for most people sticking with a diet is actually much easier than sticking to an exercise plan. Especially if you didn't grow up exercising and don't have any happy memories of exercise.

When did you start exercising regularly? Any tips for the rest of us on sticking with it long enough to form a habit?

Re: The Weight I Carry

#75
post #47
post #13

I found this study from 1973 interesting where an extremely obese individual performed a supervised fast for about a year and dropped from 456 to 180 pounds. > A 27-year-old male patient fasted under supervision for 382 days and has subsequently maintained his normal weight. Blood glucose concentrations around 30 mg/100 ml were recorded consistently during the last 8 months, although the patient was ambulant and atte…

I remember Joe Rogan and Peter Attia talking about this on Joe's podcast. The patient did supplement with yeast, for the branched-chain amino acids. And strangely, at the end of the fast, he didn't have all of that loose skin that you typically see in those with rapid weight loss. They were speculating if the BCAAs helped with that or not.

This is a phenomenon that's been noted by others regarding weightloss during fasting, so it's probably the fasting itself, rather than the BCAAs.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#76
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think exercise for weight loss/management isn't going to be a good idea for the vast majority of people. As you said, you get hungrier when you burn those calories and it's very easy to spend five minutes and eat all the calories you burned working out for an hour.

When I exercise, it puts me on a health-minded path every day that snowballs into other good decisions. It's like how they say making your bed in the morning helps put you on task the rest of the day. I find your line of thought unconvincing. The thing in common among everyone I know who is overweight is that they don't even work out at all. The amount of people I know who don't do anything is astonishing. The proble…

> The thing in common among everyone I know who is overweight is that they don't even work out at all

Exercise does not help people lose weight, and it may make it harder for people to lose weight.

Exercise is important, and we need to help more people exercise, but we should avoid suggesting that exercise helps weight loss. It does not.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#77

Watch the Fed up documentary, explains it so well that no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less wont work. Our environment is saturated with products now which almost all have added sugar, only way is to look at ingredients and change your environment, dont bring these things home and instead bring better stuff home thats not got added sugar.

> no matter how much we try, exercising and eating less won't work How can that be? If you burn more calories and you take in less calories, then surely at some point your body must start to lose mass. At very least is the equation that you're breathing out carbon and you're not getting that mass back from anything apart from what you eat.

I think weight loss is less of the issue - you're right, that is solved.

Long term weight loss is the big issue.

Let's be honest, anything that you have to maintain indefinitely - relationship, business, health/weight/muscle mass, finances - will eventually fail at some point.

And food does have that unique component of that it can't be totally avoided. You can't just cut it out of your life to become healthier (unlike say alcohol).

They're all hamster wheels. And then we die.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#78

"No matter where you stood, you were no more than 10 feet from fried chicken." I'm sorry but I just can't relate to this, which is probably why everyone in my family is thin. I can't even remember the last time I ate fried chicken. Maybe its a cultural thing (my parents were European), but there is no reason to bring fried chicken into your house. None. This is the kind of decisions that lead to being 460 pounds. Gro…

Did you post this to let us know how superior you and your family are to the author of the article?

> This is the kind of decisions that lead to being 460 pounds.

And this kind of over-simplification of a complex neurological and physiological disease isn't constructive.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#79
I've been way too close to 300 pounds for all of my adult life. This article really hits home hard. I can completely empathize with every statement the author made. I have realized his same struggles with weight loss and how hard it is to keep the weight off. I've had some success with Keto, but I seem to love eating carbs way too much to stick to it for longer than 3 months. I've told myself I'm trying a similar approach to the author: trying to do just enough to reduce slowly, but honestly to me it feels like a cop out. A way I can say that if I mess up then it's OK because most days I'm doing right. Hopefully some day I can finally snap myself into a life-changing mindset.

Re: The Weight I Carry

#80
post #13

I found this study from 1973 interesting where an extremely obese individual performed a supervised fast for about a year and dropped from 456 to 180 pounds. > A 27-year-old male patient fasted under supervision for 382 days and has subsequently maintained his normal weight. Blood glucose concentrations around 30 mg/100 ml were recorded consistently during the last 8 months, although the patient was ambulant and atte…

> I don't know why I haven't seen more studies where extremely obese individuals just stop eating.

It's probably not common because you'd be trying to study the one thing they have the most trouble doing. To understand what I mean, you have to understand that asking an extremely obese person to stop eating is like asking an Alcoholic to stop drinking. All of them know that's what they have to do but that's literally their problem, they can't stop drinking and extremely obese people can't stop eating. More importantly, the drinking and eating in these diseases is not the problem per se, they're typically symptoms of less obvious root problems.

In the case of food, these people get a dopamine rush each time they eat. It makes them feel good. But then they feel bad because they're getting fatter (for various physiological, social and psychological reasons), which then makes them want to eat more because that at least makes them feel good (temporarily). It's pretty easy to spot the mental illness and similarity to drug addiction in this feedback loop.

I know this is hard to swallow for people who find it easy not to be alcoholics or overeaters but here's a journal article that studied the connection:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4166230/

They say there is strong evidence that food addiction is similar to opiate and other psychoactive drug addictions. It also calls out alcohol and carbohydrate binges as stimulants for the brain's production and utilization of dopamine. The carbohydrates part is interesting since of course, that's literally what pig farmers use to fatten up pigs. So of course, if eating those makes you feel good and eating too many of them makes you fat then problem really starts to make sense.

I used to be obese. When I moved to a new city and found a new doctor, I asked him if there was anyone I could talk to so I could get more help. He told me it's simple, I just need to eat less and exercise more. I've been called a lot of lousy names in my life, but what he said was the most insulting thing I had ever heard... that it was simple.

You don't tell an alcoholic it's simple not to be an alcoholic, "Just stop drinking!" or to a drug addict, "Just stop taking drugs!". It's simple for you, but it's not simple for them. That's what makes them an alcoholic and not you.

I had lost 50lbs about 10 years earlier, so I knew the technical requirements to lose weight. My problem was not with dietary knowledge or exercise. But, as many doctors do, they give you advice/pills/creams/etc to improve the symptoms rather than trying to understand the root problem. I don't blame the doctor though, he didn't understand my problem.

In these cases, it has to be treated as an addiction and that's how I approached it. Once I realized my problem was one of addiction, I started to make some progress. I started to realize I would zombie walk to the kitchen like an addict in a daze, looking for a fix. I was thinking about something else completely but my body was on autopilot looking for food. I had a problem with food itself. Definitely carbs (especially sugar). I read a lot about eating disorders to better understand the problem and hoped to find a solution to the problem and not just the symptom.

I wish I found out about the link between carbs/dopamine a lot sooner. I discovered it accidentally when I found out about the Keto diet around 2013. When I cut out almost all carbs, I quickly discovered my brain fog went away, I felt happy most of the time, I wanted to exercise, I had more energy, and finally... I didn't want to eat all the time.

So, that was the basic solution for me, but even then it wasn't easy or simple. I did a lot of research and it took many false starts to finally make good progress.

I'm sorry for the wall of text, and for hijacking your comment, but I hope this helps some people understand why it's not simple to do (or study) and I hope it helps some people who have an eating disorder find their path or get professional help (if they'll listen).

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