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Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

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Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#71

Post by spookthesunset »

talltimtom wrote: post #62
tw04 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like insisting that notes look like a leather bound notebook? I'm confident he had good ideas. I'm also confident he had plenty of horrible ideas... Just like most intelligent humans.

“I'm confident he had good ideas. I'm also confident he had plenty of horrible ideas...” ... as you walk along you path you meet a man. 50% if the time he tells you sage advice that makes you a multimillionaire and 50% of the time he tells you sage advice that doesn’t make you richer. What do you value the mans afvice as? It’s not a cult or a conspiracy when what the other part is selling actually materializes.

Sounds like the expected value of his advice is a half multi-millionaire, so yeah you should take it!

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#72

Post by fullshark »

rchaud wrote: post #59

I used to think Jobs' Reality Distortion Field only worked on tech bloggers who loved Apple's story and narrative so much, they went overboard to praise their products, in spite of tone-deaf stuff Jobs would say in public like "You're holding it wrong". Turns out there were plenty of people right there at Apple who fell under that same RDF.

Did you really think the RDF as you say didn't apply to workers inside Apple? Almost always the biggest kool-aid drinkers for any company are the employees.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#73

Post by acqq »

benwerd wrote: post #12

This is how I know I would suck in a company like this. Yeah, it's Steve Jobs - but I find the level of reverence on show in this piece to be a little hard to take. It's certainly revealing of the culture there at the time. > And when you can get the time for thoughtful reflection on your idea from a visionary like Steve — well, that’s a good day. Being humble is one thing, but forcing yourself into this kind of fawn…

> He was smart; he was lucky; he was a human, like anyone else.

And like nobody else, he was personally who made Apple, Macintosh, iPod and iPhone what they were.

In short, he many times proved to really be far from average.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#74

Post by graeme »

psoy wrote: post #58
graeme wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been stories outside Apple of Steve Jobs giving incredibly good feedback in a variety of areas and people being glad to have it. Have you considered the possibility that: 1. Steve Jobs was a couple of standard deviations better at this than almost anyone 2. As such, people were glad to get feedback from him 3. Such ability is rare and hard to identify, and so trying to replicate that structure is nonethele…

> 1. Steve Jobs was a couple of standard deviations better at this than almost anyone This is a statistical oxymoron.

Yeah, you're right. I realized it when I came back and reread my comment.

Ah well, no editing now, it's up for posterity.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#75

Post by acqq »

Groxx wrote: post #41
tw04 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like insisting that notes look like a leather bound notebook? I'm confident he had good ideas. I'm also confident he had plenty of horrible ideas... Just like most intelligent humans.

Given how much easier I've seen older relatives use iPhones in the skeuomorphic days vs now: I mostly lean towards skeuomorphic being preferable. It's not as fashionable now, but it is way more approachable and unambiguous.

> it is way more approachable and unambiguous.

I agree. My older relatives also have much harder times figuring out where to touch since the fully drawn buttons are replaced by just a text.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#76

Post by junnan »

psoy wrote: post #58
graeme wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been stories outside Apple of Steve Jobs giving incredibly good feedback in a variety of areas and people being glad to have it. Have you considered the possibility that: 1. Steve Jobs was a couple of standard deviations better at this than almost anyone 2. As such, people were glad to get feedback from him 3. Such ability is rare and hard to identify, and so trying to replicate that structure is nonethele…

> 1. Steve Jobs was a couple of standard deviations better at this than almost anyone This is a statistical oxymoron.

You mean tautology?

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#77

Post by itronitron »

benwerd wrote: post #12

This is how I know I would suck in a company like this. Yeah, it's Steve Jobs - but I find the level of reverence on show in this piece to be a little hard to take. It's certainly revealing of the culture there at the time. > And when you can get the time for thoughtful reflection on your idea from a visionary like Steve — well, that’s a good day. Being humble is one thing, but forcing yourself into this kind of fawn…

Having experienced this on the passing of a colleague, I think there are an equal mix of people that genuinely feel that reverence and people that talk it up in order to increase their standing, and both of those groups are generally in the minority at any organization (with the exception of cults.)

Point being, most people at Apple probably considered Steve as a person.

Regarding the design review practices, that all sounds like good advice and rather normal when presenting to a time and attention limited audience.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#78

Post by maxxxxx »

rchaud wrote: post #61
maxxxxx wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he was very good. But from whatever I have read he was also a big jerk and could be very cruel to people.

Because the majority of the coverage about him has been praiseworthy, given his business success. Now that he's dead, criticism of him will come off as axe-grinding and bitter.

I think it's good show all facets of famous people, especially their dark sides. There is a tendency to glorify them and then think they are great people in all areas. Most times they aren't.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#79

Post by stupidbird »

graeme wrote: post #16
benwerd wrote: post #12

This is how I know I would suck in a company like this. Yeah, it's Steve Jobs - but I find the level of reverence on show in this piece to be a little hard to take. It's certainly revealing of the culture there at the time. > And when you can get the time for thoughtful reflection on your idea from a visionary like Steve — well, that’s a good day. Being humble is one thing, but forcing yourself into this kind of fawn…

There have been stories outside Apple of Steve Jobs giving incredibly good feedback in a variety of areas and people being glad to have it. Have you considered the possibility that: 1. Steve Jobs was a couple of standard deviations better at this than almost anyone 2. As such, people were glad to get feedback from him 3. Such ability is rare and hard to identify, and so trying to replicate that structure is nonethele…

He had some priorities that are atypical in CEOs which made him better at making the kind of top-down decisions a lot of companies delegate to committees.

It's not particularly rare to have a decent sense of design, but it's rare for someone with a decent sense of design to be in a position to have the final say on mass-produced tech products. Especially true of the 90s and early 00s when Apple was making huge waves.

He was also a dick to a lot of people and petulant if he didn't get his way.

None of this stuff is mutually exclusive.

Re: Stories of Steve Jobs in Safari Design Reviews (2014)

#80

Post by WalterBright »

briandear wrote: post #50
thanatropism wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a couple of standard deviations better at this The crucial thing is that "this" in this case is product management. I'm fine with Jobs being the Caesar Augustus of product; what bothers me is when he starts being touted as the Christ of Business.

It worked though. Apple is the most valuable American company when measured by market cap. That didn’t accidentally happen.

Steve Jobs is the canonical example of why CEOs matter and are well paid.
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