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Sales mistakes that software engineers make

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71–80 of 204 posts

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#71

I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. The article suggests doing a search for potential companies, finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails. But what about experimental technologies or developer tools? I wouldn't expect a lot of success with a slow movin…

> there's no way to search "startups using x" for a generic technology, like serverless or NoSQL.

Smells like a side project waiting to be built.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#72

I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. The article suggests doing a search for potential companies, finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails. But what about experimental technologies or developer tools? I wouldn't expect a lot of success with a slow movin…

> there's no way to search "startups using x" for a generic technology, like serverless or NoSQL. Smells like a side project waiting to be built.

Search job boards for job openings that list the technology as a requirement.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#73

I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. The article suggests doing a search for potential companies, finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails. But what about experimental technologies or developer tools? I wouldn't expect a lot of success with a slow movin…

>finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails Has that ever worked? I'm not on LinkedIn, yet somehow companies still find my work email and I'm always getting emails from people about how there product is the best thing ever and can we set up a call, or there is a webinar, or can they come by. Oh, and did I not see their previous attempts to reach me? Yes, I saw them, but I've never responded to any of t…

It works if you are selling something of actual value and mail the right person.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#74

I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. The article suggests doing a search for potential companies, finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails. But what about experimental technologies or developer tools? I wouldn't expect a lot of success with a slow movin…

>finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails Has that ever worked? I'm not on LinkedIn, yet somehow companies still find my work email and I'm always getting emails from people about how there product is the best thing ever and can we set up a call, or there is a webinar, or can they come by. Oh, and did I not see their previous attempts to reach me? Yes, I saw them, but I've never responded to any of t…

>I just can't imagine cold-calling/emailing people actually

If it didn't work people wouldn't be doing it I presume. It probably works every now and then but it's good enough when the cost of doing it is low.

When does it work? When you reach someone who is actively looking for it.

For example, in the talk given by YC Partner Aaron Harris[0], suggests that cold e-mailing professional investors work when done right.

[0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jzz4AEIddzY

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#75
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “If you talk to a bunch of potential customers about a product idea and discover that there is demand for the product, then building a MVP that you can demo would be a logical next step. And if the MVP is something you can build quickly, then it probably makes sense to do this sooner than later.” Sales to Engineering Managers: Alright team, we’ve talked with a lot of customers and realized there is a huge demand fo…

You should have really spent the time it took you to type in this over-the-top response to read the article with a bit more sympathy instead. It's not necessary to solve unsolvable technical challenges to make something that helps people.

How do you know they are solvable if you pick what problems to solve before consulting engineers about feasibility or cost?

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#76

I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. The article suggests doing a search for potential companies, finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails. But what about experimental technologies or developer tools? I wouldn't expect a lot of success with a slow movin…

>I fall into the "Build before talking to customers" trap constantly. Even though I know it's "wrong", it is hard to escape it because of the simple problem of not knowing who to talk to. There isnt necessarily a 'right way' to do things. I have received terrible advice from marketing/business people. Showing people my MVP was fine for some customers, but others didnt trust me based on a low quality landing page. Whi…

It took me years to realise that whenever a non-tech person would see the ugly UI he would actually lie to me about the prospects and give me some generic advice because they simply didn't want to appear dumb.

Not all of them are like that, but you get used to the overthinking approach most of the techies take so you expect some critique rather than some sort of defensive take on the matter.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#77

The first point is often totally wrong. I worked in a place where the sales team sold the product hard before much of it was built and before it was reliable. It turned out to be way harder to build what customers actually wanted than anyone knew ahead of time. Nobody could foresee it. The only way we could have known we were egregiously over-promising in the sales pitches was to just actually start building it first…

I've seen a similar situation play out at a startup and I can see your point. However, I think there's a difference between talking to potential customers about requirements they have vs. promising to deliver a solution for them on the spot. IMO you don't have to, or rather shouldn't, close the sale when first reaching out to potential customers like this. The goal should be to simply validate the problem statement -…

I totally agree with you if we are talking about preliminary market research, which also usually involves components of research into the technical investment required.

That said, the article of this post seems to emphatically say something different: that you should actively _sell_ before building. Not merely collect research, but to sell stuff you do not already have the capability to deliver, and then somehow backfill that delivery capability after getting customer buy-in.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#78
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>finding contacts on linkedin, and sending out some emails Has that ever worked? I'm not on LinkedIn, yet somehow companies still find my work email and I'm always getting emails from people about how there product is the best thing ever and can we set up a call, or there is a webinar, or can they come by. Oh, and did I not see their previous attempts to reach me? Yes, I saw them, but I've never responded to any of t…

It works if you are selling something of actual value and mail the right person.

My entire business is built on this simple statement. Research research research then contact.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#79
> The responses that customers give to thoughtful, open-ended questions inform how customers think about their problems, needs, budgets, timeline, decision making process, fears, alternative options to your product, and the extent to which they perceive that your product solves their problem.

What I'd like to add here, since the article only indirectly says so, is that you shouldn't take any idea or request you get literally and start implementing it. Try to figure out what the underlying problem of the customer is, since often times they already have half a solution in their mind and just tell you what they need to make it work, when there might actually be a completely different approach to their problem that they didn't think of. I think that's the hard part of talking to customers.

And obviously, if your product does seem to be a good fit for the customer, but requires some rethinking of how to organize things or change workflows, finally selling the product is still hard, because they won't immediately see the benefit. In those cases, word of mouth really is your best friend, which somewhat requires you're selling in a sector where potential customers are strongly networked, so anything in the public sector is a good example here.

> Many engineers I've talked to report experiencing social anxiety and a sense of discomfort during sales conversations.

Something I can relate to. I really learned a lot in this field over the years, but I still leave selling to sales people. I'm often times joining our sales rep when he's visiting new or potential customers because of what I can learn, and just in case the customer has some specific technical questions. But when there's questions about feature requests or anything they dislike I'm easily tempted to always give honest answers like "uh I don't think this can easily be changed, I'd have to think about how I'd approach this", which, while honesty in general is a good thing, just doesn't work well in a sales conversation, like you have no clue about what you're doing. So I know when to shut up and let the sales guy fill in for me.

As of #3, we approach this by giving every customer a free trial of 6 month and then a 50% discount for the next 6 month. Since our product falls into the category of requiring some rethinking and restructuring, this has proven to be an excellent strategy, since we are often met with equal amounts of interest and hesitation.

Re: Sales mistakes that software engineers make

#80
post #24

> Sales Mistake #1 - Building Before you Start Selling (...) If you’re wrong, you’ll save time and money by not building something people don’t want. I fell into this trap often, so I know it well. The reason why we don't ask first is, we want to build something . Anything. If we're "wrong", we won't "save" time and money, we will delay the moment we start making, maybe indefinitely. What if we never find something p…

>> The reason why we don't ask first is, we want to build something.

Correlation isn't causation. Please don't be too upfront about "why we don't ask first".

Have you often encountered a situation where your non-tech boss didn't listen enough and you were right in the end? Or the cases when he even forgets a month later you were right in the first place? Or the times when you decided not to listen to your management and do it your way and they never realised it was you who was responsible for fixing it at all?

It's not just "being afraid of not finding what people want". It's also the psychology "maybe they don't understand it yet, so I should spend a bit more time on it". The sunk costs and the vision is what drives it.

It's amazing how easily people try to reduce behaviours of people to some singular emotion.

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