anyone else read the title as e-chocolate? The capital E makes it look like a proper noun, like Email. Crazy thing how these letters in our alphabet work. We need a better alphabet! Ya?
I didn't, but I can't stop doing it now.
Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
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Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#72For anyone wanting to see a master example of echolocation see this short video: https://youtu.be/TeFRkAYb1uk
I instantly thought of this video as well. Definitely an extraordinary human. Sadly, he passed away a few years ago. Warning, here be feels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnouXX1meso
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#73Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't know that Google was ever the thing to find them. Various curated lists and word-of-mouth were how they spread. But yeah, the signal-to-noise ratio is pretty terrible now for anything that isn't a ho-hum "conventional" query. On the other hand, the sheer volume of information has to count for something. You can reach a greater breadth and depth for directed learning online than in the 90's where it was mostly…
> I don't know that Google was ever the thing to find them. Various curated lists and word-of-mouth were how they spread. There was a period in the mid-'90s at least when you could find really interesting personal pages by punching any given topic into your search engine of choice. It may actually have been petering out by the time Google arrived in '98, though.
google.com/search?q=human+echolocation brings up a ton of related stuff.
The thing is "what do you type into the search engine." I, for one, would never think to type in any of probably tens of thousands of topics that, having seen, I think are awesome.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
You should now go donate some bucks to Merlin Tuttle's Bat Conservation for your sins ( https://merlintuttlesbatconservation.kindful.com/ ) ;) since they are by far the coolest mammal. Humans are OK too I guess... I have a really hard time believing any of these echolocation claims by individuals. I can see it maybe coming about if you're visually disabled and over a very long period of time it comes about as your vi…
"Blind as a bat" is a common expression in English. Free Dictionary says it's been around since the 1500s, and theorizes that people thought their erratic flight was due to poor eyesight. https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/blind+as+a+bat
I was referring to the "poor as a church mouse" expression actually but thanks for the etymology regarding the other expression - sounds plausible.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#75This article reminds me of how it felt to be on the internet as a child. It seemed like this magical place where around every corner there was hidden an alchemic recipe to achieve something magical, if only you knew how to search in the right places.
Well said. For me the 90s and early 2000s internet was completely magical. My fondest memories of my teens was finally having a computer in my room and the freedom to stay up late and explore the online universe. I met a lot of people and saw the advent of a lot of new things. I wonder if that's going to happen for my kids. Today's internet feels so highly commercialized. All the new exciting discoveries are in the f…
>* My fondest memories of my teens was finally having a computer in my room and the freedom to stay up late and explore the online universe*
This is something i think about regarding my kids... specifically that my experience was free and unfettered - theirs is contolled, walled and full of ads and bullshit.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#76This article reminds me of how it felt to be on the internet as a child. It seemed like this magical place where around every corner there was hidden an alchemic recipe to achieve something magical, if only you knew how to search in the right places.
Well said. For me the 90s and early 2000s internet was completely magical. My fondest memories of my teens was finally having a computer in my room and the freedom to stay up late and explore the online universe. I met a lot of people and saw the advent of a lot of new things. I wonder if that's going to happen for my kids. Today's internet feels so highly commercialized. All the new exciting discoveries are in the f…
> I wonder if that's going to happen for my kids.
I've got a four month old. By the time she's in third or fourth grade, I expect that VR will give her the same kinds of experiences that I had with the web at that age. What made the web exciting wasn't just the fact that it was run by amateurs, it was the fact that there was just an enormous amount of possibility waiting to be explored where we genuinely didn't know the answers.
I actually think the web itself may go back into that kind of phase again after a couple more iterations of Moore's Law make programming easy enough for people who wouldn't be able to do it today, especially when combined with blockchain opening up new kinds of relationships that people can have with one another. The web currently has some issues, but I think a lot of people have given up on it prematurely without taking into consideration the new kinds of experiences the recent and upcoming improvements to the underlying infrastructure are going to make possible.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#77Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think relative pitch is much more useful (e.g. identifying harmonies and notes relative to a tonic center).
(Perfect pitch here) Hehe how is it "much more useful"? When I hear music, I simultaneously know what all the notes and chords are. That's what hearing music is for me. I can't imagine not having it, as an improvising musician. Hearing a note or chord without knowing exactly what is is?! People without it somehow manage, but it is like flying blind.
Oh it definitely is like a a sort of blindness.
I love music, and the best I can do pitchwise is remember a few references. So, it is like one or two perfect pitches. I worked at recall on those... hard. It takes an immersive memory to do, and it is like a little movie of that time and place. When I do that, I can get a note from a song I know well.
And I know what that note is on the scale. Good as it gets. Strange, I can often tell same or different too, even whem some time has passed, but mapping notes to pitches heard is hard.
The other one, btw, is 1khz. The Apple 2 beep. Similar memory. And both are fond ones.
Otherwise, I have great discrimination. Can pluck parts out a total mess, usually no problem. And I hear technical details well. Production, essentially, or signals in the noise.
I knew a girl with perfect pitch. Her recall of things and a conversation encouraged me to try, and it worked, but so much effort! And only for a couple, and those are shaky at best!
But, I have just a taste, and that is enough to validate what you put here. No way can I just pluck chords out of something without first getting some references. It's a sort of build up. Do a listen, tag some notes, do it again, tag some more, and over some iterations note values, chords become clear. And that sticks while I have the head space. Let it slip, and a lot slips. In that space, I could play, improvise then.
She could often just listen and write down whole phrases! Of course it was pretty great having her around. I could just ask for one, and she would nail it. Thanks!
A lot of how people manage is by feel and other cues. Or, they just do not improvise to the degree possible. Or, they do not care, instead just working from where things are at. Say, a fifth up would be good... doing that only needs a sense of the scale in play.
In any case, I do not agree relative pitch is intrinsically more useful. I would not value it that way.
What is generally more useful is being able to really listen. I do that and it comes in very handy for testing, various electromechanical tasks. Over time, I have gotten really good at being able to play sound back in my head that I have heard in the past.
On odd artifact is playing that radio snippet game. If I have heard the tune, I can often get it in very short, sometimes sub second bits of audio. All comes down to what is in that snip. Vocals are easiest. Even a bit, and the map to the person lights right up.
Or, a mechanism. If it is doing anything odd, I hear that and know what normal is to good precision.
Discrimination is broadly useful, maybe most useful in the broadest sense, I would argue. At least there is a strong case for it.
YMMV
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
Situational awareness goes way down when people walk around with headphones with loud music. I notice it on a lot of people and how they behave in traffic. Just listening to things around you can be quite interesting as you move around. I never wear headphones for this reason. On interesting thing is to open the windows (and sunroof) in an electric car, whilst driving in built up areas < 20 mph/35 km/h, you hear a lo…
On a motorcycle one is much more connected to the environment and I think that is one reason people like them. Its fun to come down into a hollow and feel the temperature change. Smells are also easily detected. Sound, on the other hand, is mostly the motorcycle noise (which can be fun too). Reading this comment made me think it would be really interesting to try out an electric motorcycle.
I've always said that one of the most rewarding sensations on when riding for fun is the access to the variety of smells and sounds and as someone mentioned, a well designed helmet makes a world of difference.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#79This reminds me of a ted talk I had the pleasure to enjoy watching with a good friend while "intoxicated". The talk's title is "Can we create new senses for humans?" by David Eagleman and is available at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4c1lqFXHvqI
Not sure how "intoxicated" is different from intoxicated but this was a great TED talk, thnx.
Re: Teach Yourself to Echolocate: A beginner’s guide to navigating with sound
#80For anyone wanting to see a master example of echolocation see this short video: https://youtu.be/TeFRkAYb1uk
I remembering learning about this boy in high school. In the posted article, he suggests that non-blind humans can simulate the handicap by wearing a blindfold. For someone who isn't blind, learning how to do this is very difficult. This is the kind of skill that rewires your brain and comes out of necessity rather than desire. By actually being blind, you get 10,000 hours of practice in around two years. Even if you…
Have you ever tried? I find the article's description a bit too advanced for a first try. I have personally had success finding walls or large furniture after only a couple minutes of very slowly walking around a room and clicking my tongue (higher pitched) with my eyes closed. True, I probably won't ever be able to ride a bike, but it's sufficient to quickly test out basic echolocation. I have done many trials with friends and everyone is able to hear at least a subtle difference when standing directly in front of a wall as opposed to a few feet away.