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Smoking around the world

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Re: Smoking around the world

#71

Post by Freak_NL »

zavi wrote: post #18
anewone wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking is scary on an individual level, not to mention expensive. Those other causes you mentioned aren't interesting if you don't personally need them. It's harder to get someone to make a short term sacrifice for other people's long term gains.

A better analogy would be a potential campaign to reduce obesity. If US could pull off a public fat shaming campaign as successful and the one around tobacco it would be a huge benefit to individual people's quality of life as well as economy as a whole.

Obesity hurts society by taxing the healthcare system, and by setting an unhealthy example (mainly by normalizing being fat). Smoking does this, but also directly harms non-smoking individuals via second and third hand (via clothing, carpets, drapes, etc.) smoke. The latter (harm to others) made it a lot easier to change society's views on smoking.

Re: Smoking around the world

#72

Post by pg314 »

briandear wrote: post #43
zavi wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better analogy would be a potential campaign to reduce obesity. If US could pull off a public fat shaming campaign as successful and the one around tobacco it would be a huge benefit to individual people's quality of life as well as economy as a whole.

Except people have no problem making snide comments to smokers when they are smoking outside of a building, but there’d be all sorts of #meTooImFat outrage if you started tsk-tsking fat people eating ice cream. However, it really isn’t anyone’s business if I’m fat. You could argue health insurance is a shared risk pool, but under that logic, we’d be giving the government the right to dictate every aspect of your life…

> It could get absurd, but the moment you let the government control even something small, it just keeps growing until we are quite literally Nazi germany where only “ideal” people are allowed to breed or receive permission to open businesses or get desirable jobs.

You are making a non-sensical slippery slope argument. Heroin has been prohibited for a long time in the US, yet it hasn't turned into Nazi Germany.

Re: Smoking around the world

#73

Post by dragonwriter »

briandear wrote: post #43
zavi wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better analogy would be a potential campaign to reduce obesity. If US could pull off a public fat shaming campaign as successful and the one around tobacco it would be a huge benefit to individual people's quality of life as well as economy as a whole.

Except people have no problem making snide comments to smokers when they are smoking outside of a building, but there’d be all sorts of #meTooImFat outrage if you started tsk-tsking fat people eating ice cream. However, it really isn’t anyone’s business if I’m fat. You could argue health insurance is a shared risk pool, but under that logic, we’d be giving the government the right to dictate every aspect of your life…

> It could get absurd, but the moment you let the government control even something small, it just keeps growing until we are quite literally Nazi germany where only “ideal” people are allowed to breed or receive permission to open businesses or get desirable jobs.

Every government controls more than something small. Very few of them ever turn into Nazi Germany. So, no, I don't think that slippery slope is a useful guideline for evaluating real world questions.

Re: Smoking around the world

#74

Post by point78 »

Very disappointed in EU here! Such a disgusting habit that kills and leads to large quality of life loss later in life.

Needs to be severely reduced or banned altogether.

Seeing 15 year olds smoke is a huge societal failure.

Re: Smoking around the world

#75

Post by eadmund »

ams6110 wrote: post #56
elorant wrote: post #20

I quit the damn thing some 13 years ago and I've never looked back since. Best decision I've ever made. Earned back my life, I'm in my mid forties and my physical endurance is way better than what it was in my twenties. The thing that most smokers don't realize is that smoking is like taking heroin. You're addicted to a substance that's slowly and silently killing you. Just a couple of years ago I lost a very good fr…

My dad was a smoker most of his life. He quit in his 50s. Years later I asked him if he missed it, and his answer was "every single day."

I love tobacco. It smells wonderful (no, not cigarettes: tobacco itself, as anyone who's ever smelt pipe smoke will confirm). It tastes delicious (albeit not as good as it smells). It feels wonderful. It even cuts down on appetite, which is a plus in this day and age!

I quit smoking for love, but I miss it every time I think of it. Nonsmokers have no idea what they're missing. It's sheer bliss. The sooner we can figure out how to have noncarcinogenic smoke, the better.

Re: Smoking around the world

#76

Post by eadmund »

jpatokal wrote: post #63
toomanybeersies wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New Zealand also introduced plain packaging recently. An interesting side effect of plain packaging is that it's made the prevalence of illegally imported cigarettes much more noticeable. There's a fair amount tobacco smuggled in from Indonesia and SE Asia, and you can notice it now because the smuggled packs of smokes still have branding on them.

In Singapore, importing tobacco is illegal full stop (no duty-free or duty-paid allowance) and all legal locally sold tobacco is stamped "SDPC" (Singapore Duty-Paid Cigarette). If you're caught by police with an unstamped cigarette, the first offence fine is $500. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/25-smokers-caught-wit...

Singapore also hangs first-time drugs offenders, as I recall. I don't know that I'd suggest emulating their laws with respect to a substance.

Re: Smoking around the world

#77

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

geomark wrote: post #19
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven’t seen any numbers, but I would have thought tiny minority would be more accurate?

In some areas the percentage of unvaccinated is quite high. See this map of anti-vaxxers by county http://rpubs.com/markdg/AntivaxxerHotspots It uses the Personal Belief Exemption for school children as a proxy for the general population of anti-vaxxers. So arguably a bit inaccurate.

Colour me highly in accurate!

I sit not just corrected, but fairly shocked.

Re: Smoking around the world

#78

Post by aplummer »

ddeck wrote: post #58
e40 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 25 pack of Marlboros will set you back AU$32 (US$23). I don't smoke, but a pack in CA is, according to DDG, US$8. For comparison, 25 x US$8 = US$200.

The comparison is US$23 to US$8. In Australia, it's US$23 for a pack of 25 cigarettes. Not a carton of 25 packs of cigarettes.

I actually really like that cigarettes are so expensive the above poster made that error.

Re: Smoking around the world

#80

Post by staz »

point78 wrote: post #74

Very disappointed in EU here! Such a disgusting habit that kills and leads to large quality of life loss later in life. Needs to be severely reduced or banned altogether. Seeing 15 year olds smoke is a huge societal failure.

Most countries in the EU are taking steps to combat this and the number of smokers is steadily diminishing, even if too slowly.

I'm more worried about the non smoker countries which the tobacco companies are seeing as new territories to conquer.

John Oliver did a good segment about that two years ago https://youtu.be/6UsHHOCH4q8?t=239

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