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In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

nytimes.com

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Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#71

Post by vfc1 »

jazoom wrote: post #58
vfc1 wrote: post #55

Its by far time for we to leave the fishes of the hook. Dynamite fishing is bad but its just the tip of the iceberg in what concerns the global impact of fishing. What about: - the widespread use of human slaves in southeast Asia still in 2018? - Or the massive ocean dead zones that keep getting bigger? - Or the 25% of by-catch (fish caught unintentionally and discarded)? - or the estimates that certain oceans will b…

You've got some good points there but also a lot of claims that really should be backed up by solid references.

You're right, here are some sources. Here is an article on the use of human slaves for fishing in Asia, they get kidnapped in villages in india and many other places, this is happening today, as we speak and at a large scale - http://www.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazine/long-reads/artic...

Here is an article on how ocean dead zones quadrupled since 1950 https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jan/04/oceans-s...

The fishing industry now impacts 55% of the world oceans - https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/02/180222162124.h...

For the health consequences of fish - https://nutritionfacts.org/topics/fish/

"Eating just a single serving of fish each week during pregnancy, for example, can lead to more mercury in their infant’s body than injecting them directly with about a dozen mercury-containing vaccines."

And from the American Heart Association "Fish oil supplements may help prevent death after a heart attack but lack evidence of cardiovascular benefit for the general population" - https://newsroom.heart.org/news/fish-oil-supplements-may-hel...

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#72

Post by nickthemagicman »

ponzored wrote: post #32
acchow wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? This has nothing to do with the rich. This is the tragedy of the commons - other fishers are allowed to use dynamite to fish extremely effectively, so the only way for you to make a living wage is to do the same.

I think its a general cultural disdain for the environment within some cultures. Most of the world's plastic pollution coming out of 10 Asian and African rivers for example. This is why arguments from educated, intelligent and responsible Westerners that they themselves shouldn't have children in order to reduce the impact on the planet are flawed. If not for their children with the same skills and views, who else wi…

The first thing the world needs is to wrestle money from these billionaires and fund education for people.

Educated people will understand the impact of their kids, and also have a better chance at making a contribution to society, and taking care of their families they do have.

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#73

Post by AuthorizedCust »

vfc1 wrote: post #71
jazoom wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've got some good points there but also a lot of claims that really should be backed up by solid references.

You're right, here are some sources. Here is an article on the use of human slaves for fishing in Asia, they get kidnapped in villages in india and many other places, this is happening today, as we speak and at a large scale - http://www.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazine/long-reads/artic... Here is an article on how ocean dead zones quadrupled since 1950 https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jan/04/oceans-s...…

Your article about fish oil doesn't prove that fish oil isn't helpful. Supplements, in general, have often been shown not to have the protective effects expected, but that doesn't disprove the substance's effect when consumed in its natural host.

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#74

Post by jackvalentine »

pas wrote: post #50
dotancohen wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Europeans now sail to Somalia to fish. They are doing terrific damage there, and the local human and animal populations there are suffering food shortages as a result.

Could you elaborate on this please?

Somalian pirates are the result of international fishing fleets depleting the fish in the area giving the local fishermen few other options.

(It’s more complicated than that, but so is everything)

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#75

Post by PostOnce »

vfc1 wrote: post #71
jazoom wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've got some good points there but also a lot of claims that really should be backed up by solid references.

You're right, here are some sources. Here is an article on the use of human slaves for fishing in Asia, they get kidnapped in villages in india and many other places, this is happening today, as we speak and at a large scale - http://www.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazine/long-reads/artic... Here is an article on how ocean dead zones quadrupled since 1950 https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jan/04/oceans-s...…

earlier this week, an article was posted to hn about IQ scores having fallen since the 70s, at https://medicalxpress.com/news/2018-06-iq-scores-1970s.html

one key takeaway: A British team recently found IQ score results falling by 2.5 to 4.3 points every decade since approximately the end of the second world war. And this past December, another group from the U.S. found that children who grew up eating a lot of fish tended to have higher IQs—and they slept better, too, which is another factor involved in adult intelligence levels. Notably, children in many countries in the modern era eat very little fish.

Also, "a dozen mercury-containing vaccines", how much mercury is that? Is this like telling me not to fly because I get 1000x more radiation from it than eating a banana? Comparing the miniscule to the infinitesimal makes neither large.

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#76

Post by [deleted] »

titzer wrote: post #54
ponzored wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think its a general cultural disdain for the environment within some cultures. Most of the world's plastic pollution coming out of 10 Asian and African rivers for example. This is why arguments from educated, intelligent and responsible Westerners that they themselves shouldn't have children in order to reduce the impact on the planet are flawed. If not for their children with the same skills and views, who else wi…

> Most of the world's plastic pollution coming out of 10 Asian and African rivers for example. Well I've been to a lot of places with plastic pollution problems and I picked up gobs of that shit off the world's beaches. I can tell you that despite their prevalence, plastic bottles, chip bags, straws, flippers, lids, cups, forks, and knives don't spring out of the ground. They don't grow on trees. Most aren't made in…

[deleted]

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#77

Post by jackvalentine »

candiodari wrote: post #47
shams93 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Philippines are catholic so birth control might actually be illegal, if the Catholic Church is concerned about the environment they need to promote birth control not present it as a cardinal sin. Countries like this the pope holds a heck of a lot of sway. He talks a good game about global warming but here is where the rubber meets the road. For the sake of the common good they need to shift the focus of sin from…

And what is the solution given that these people exist ? Because undoing that seems immoral now, even by non-catholic standards. I mean the best interpretation of your comment is wishing for an alternate world (in which millions of people would never have been alive in the first place). In the middle the comment is assigning blame for that. At worst ... I get that dozens of millions of people not being alive would so…

He’s talking about the millions of people not yet born.

When you find yourself in a hole the first thing to do is stop digging.

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#78

Post by daliusd »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #68
superflyguy wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those 8 people must work really hard to have earned all that money.

They worked hard to get born to rich parents.

You have very low margin for being called "rich" in that case. Some of the top richest people were born in quite average Westerners family.

E.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Bezos#Early_life_and_educ...

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#79

Post by zip1234 »

nickthemagicman wrote: post #72
ponzored wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think its a general cultural disdain for the environment within some cultures. Most of the world's plastic pollution coming out of 10 Asian and African rivers for example. This is why arguments from educated, intelligent and responsible Westerners that they themselves shouldn't have children in order to reduce the impact on the planet are flawed. If not for their children with the same skills and views, who else wi…

The first thing the world needs is to wrestle money from these billionaires and fund education for people. Educated people will understand the impact of their kids, and also have a better chance at making a contribution to society, and taking care of their families they do have.

Huh? Isn't Bill Gates spending his money strategically to best help those people. He's spent over $15 Billion dollars on vaccines. I highly doubt a government will be able to spend that money more effectively.

Re: In the Philippines, Dynamite Fishing Decimates Entire Ocean Food Chains

#80

Post by pas »

jackvalentine wrote: post #74
pas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on this please?

Somalian pirates are the result of international fishing fleets depleting the fish in the area giving the local fishermen few other options. (It’s more complicated than that, but so is everything)

Sorry, but that explains nothing for me.

OP said: Europeans now sail to Somalia to fish.

Why would Europeans go so South into the Gulf of Arden? Why would Norwegian fishers go South? What's going on? Where's the data? What are the incentives?

Does Somalia have fishing quotas? Is there any anti-overfishing agreement system for that region?

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