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Make your own sourdough

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Re: Make your own sourdough

#71

Post by bonesss »

bgaluszka wrote: post #53
chrissnell wrote: post #4

I had a starter for several years that was descended from the one kept by Dick Proenekke [1]. He lived alone in a cabin that he built himself--by hand--deep in the Alaskan bush. He made sourdough pancakes daily and his original starter came from a friend of his back in town. Someone related to this person sells the starter (on a wooden spoon) that you can buy [2] and use to create your own descendant. There's a fasci…

Correct me if I'm wrong but if you get sourdough made at some other place after couple of weeks your local culture will take over thus sourdough will loose that other place uniqueness so to speak. But I'm not an expert just something I remember when I was interested in sourdough and pizza making.

I think that's a feature, not a bug :)

The sourdough that comes from your kitchen is going to be unique to that place. Even moving across town can have a huge difference. It's a built-in thumbprint that makes sure that no one can ever really make grandmas pizza bottoms, or baguettes, quite the same...

Re: Make your own sourdough

#72

Post by lostlogin »

hendricius wrote: post #36
hahla wrote: post #25

I find it funny that this is post is popular because the title includes “an engineers guide.” As a hobbyist bread and pizza maker there are so many amazing resources across pizzamaking.com, YouTube and reddit that have years of community input I’m almost insulted that this is more popular.

I really tried to skip all the mambojambo. Most recipes do not go into detail to answer the question of the why. It's almost like using any kind library when programming. You don't know the internals. My goal however is to really deep dive and actually go through the process of how the internals of that library work.

My bread method is the opposite - how many steps can I skip and get a great result. The answer for me has resulted in a loaf started just now (with a 10 year old starter). It’s evening now and I’ll cook it tomorrow at midday. Edit: I’m talking about a bread recipe, not a starter one, which is clearly an important difference.

Re: Make your own sourdough

#73

Post by bonesss »

hendricius wrote: post #10
chrissnell wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The starter was great but it's just sourdough starter. My palette is not refined enough to taste the difference between various sourdough cultures. Use the instructions in OP's link and it will probably be just as good. I think it's neat to have a starter from a place that's special to you. You could make one in your hometown, or in a favorite vacation spot, a place famous for its sourdough (like San Francisco), etc.

Here in Germany many people trade starters across villages. It would be interesting to have a scientific study on the differences. Maybe there is different bacteria/yeast in the different villages?

The yeast isn't just different between villages, it's different from street to street.

Wild yeast is everywhere, and very different from place to place. To my understanding a little jar of one culture stands no chance against the evolutionary pressures outside it, so within a week or two an imported starter will return to whatever yeast exist in that specific area.

Trading across villages would be a really good way to keep 'new' flavours coming in :)

Re: Make your own sourdough

#74

Post by lostlogin »

atomical wrote: post #40
jvkersch wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My bread has increased in quality so much by (a) mixing the ingredients (without the yeast, or with only a little bit of the sourdough starter) the night before (i.e. making a poolish), and (b) taking a full day to prepare: you knead a little, let it rest for a couple of hours, give it a few turns, rest, etc. As a result, the bread is much more flavorful, and the flavor is more delicate: not too sour, not too sweet,…

My bread has much better flavor if I let the dough sit in the fridge for four days.

Better oven rise too, and over rise is the best kind.

Re: Make your own sourdough

#75

Post by lostlogin »

ktpsns wrote: post #60

As a German, I appreciate this. I don't like the idea of nations, but in cultural terms, bread is one of the best innovations in this country. I always miss high quality bread when going to the US.

Your doing down your beer and desserts.

Re: Make your own sourdough

#76

Post by lostlogin »

seanhunter wrote: post #14
hendricius wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't freezing kill the bacteria and yeast?

It's pretty hardy and goes dormant. You only need a few alive to grow a healthy starter back when you need it again, so every now and then I make an extra amount, mix in a little more flour than normal, spread it in blobs on an aluminium foil-covered baking tray and stick the whole thing in the freezer. After a few hours I come back, pop them off the foil and into a freezer bag. When reviving, I try to use two blobs…

Mine lives in the fridge and works just fine. A month or two in the freezer once by accident was fine too.

Re: Make your own sourdough

#77

Post by ArekDymalski »

lostlogin wrote: post #68
lmilcin wrote: post #55

Recipe is fine for sure, and I was doing this for a long time, but some time ago I have learned superior way of keeping sourdough. The oft cited recipe asks for feeding it every day and also keeping something like 100% hydration. Remembering to feed it every day is a major hassle for me. My sourdough is a piece of bread dough that is enough to use for my next batch. Basically, after first rise and before I shape my b…

I’ve got a lazier option. Get some starter, add 70g of flour, 100g water and leave it overnight. Then stick it in the fridge and use it like you’d use a very slow working shop bought yeast (and maybe 20g at a time). Don’t feed it till it gets low. Treat it mean, any more effort on it is wasted. Mine’s coming up on 10 years old now and is just fine. I accidentally put it in the freezer and lost it for a month, I think…

I'm sure that in few million years the story of this suffering will become a foundation of their culture ;)

Re: Make your own sourdough

#79

Post by firmgently »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #54
hahla wrote: post #25

I find it funny that this is post is popular because the title includes “an engineers guide.” As a hobbyist bread and pizza maker there are so many amazing resources across pizzamaking.com, YouTube and reddit that have years of community input I’m almost insulted that this is more popular.

It's not a great "engineer's guide" though. My main issue at a glance is it's too linear "Day 7 Add another round of ingredients. Day 8 You are done". it doesn't work that predictably. You have to describe the outcome you're waiting for, it might happen on an earlier day or later. For SW engineers, it's a "while (!ready())" loop, not a "for (day in 1..8)" loop. Maybe it worked that way once for the OP. But it will va…

Yes! I'd been baking all my own bread for years but had repeatedly failed to cultivate a sourdough starter despite following lots of guides to the letter. I finally got mine living nicely when I completely let go, stopped measuring and worrying, just learned to smell and watch. I pour flour in straight from the bag and splash water from a big container, as long as the consistency is somewhere between thin mud and thick mud it can work (I think heavily chlorinated water makes it very difficult though). I have no fridge in summer and little-to-no heating in winter, my starter just sits on a shelf at various temperatures... if I don't use/feed it for a while it needs a couple of days of feeding to get busy again. Even when it's not very lively I still make dough, it just takes longer to rise (and the taste/sourness might vary). I've not bought commercial yeast for a year now, all my bread is sourdough. Flour, water, salt, those are all my bread contains...well, those and billions of tiny fungi and bacteria.

I feel like once flour was invented sourdough was inevitable. Adding water to ground up grain is an obvious move as it binds it and makes it easier to work with. At some point a flour/water mix is going to be left standing and start bubbling, and when cooked it's going to get magically bigger. Boom, bread.

I enjoyed the post, always glad to see anything bread related. Baking bread has been a huge positive thing in my life, I'll never stop now (I was even without an oven for a year and learned to bake bread in a cast iron pot on a gas burner/hob). It's a rich sensory experience with all the smells and textures, and working dough is very grounding and 'real'. Every loaf is different and it's great fun waiting to see what's going to come out of the oven. I'd massively recommend getting into bread!

Re: Make your own sourdough

#80

Post by lostlogin »

atomical wrote: post #46
slow_donkey wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do this also for time control. I can effectively bake whenever convenient if it's half dormant in the fridge.

Also, no need to knead with this method.

Good point. Mine gets stirred and warmed up in a bread maker for 45 minutes, then goes into the fridge. If I forget it sits there until I remember. Once risen it’s knocked back and put into a banneton to rise. Then into the oven. The move into the banneton is the only time I touch it before eating.
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