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China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

foreignpolicy.com

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Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#71

Post by wu-ikkyu »

konschubert wrote: post #60
rohit2412 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't have anything against USA, but a world with a single superpower is prone to bullying and abuse by the said superpower. Many of us just want a peaceful world, and if that needs to be multipolar, so be it

A unipolar world tends to be more peaceful than a multipolar one simply because there isn't much opportunity for conflict. Peaceful, not necessarily fair or free.

>A unipolar world tends to be more peaceful than a multipolar one simply because there isn't much opportunity for conflict.

This statement ignores the mass murder it takes to become the number one power

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#72

Post by ddorian43 »

madengr wrote: post #45
jimmytidey wrote: post #29

Commentary on China's social credit system so often fails to note the many parallels in western societies. * The West has social credit scoring: money. A key principle of market economies is that accruing money is the just reward for contributing to society. Your bank account is your social credit score - yet we all know that many people get rich without rendering a useful service to society. * Intelligence agencies…

Western intelligence agencies don’t keep risk scores on everyone. Take off the tin foil hat.

NSA does, no ? They keep your text/voice, just in case, something comes up.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#73

Post by chrischen »

faitswulff wrote: post #63
throwafk81 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Police of London actively scan and monitor social networks looking for “hate speech” so they can pursue legal action. What’s the difference between that and what China does?

Shouldn't hate speech should be punished?

London deemed hate wpeech punishable, China determines certain speech (that it deems bad for society as well) punishable. No difference except for a difference in perspective.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#74

Post by dalbasal »

jimmytidey wrote: post #29

Commentary on China's social credit system so often fails to note the many parallels in western societies. * The West has social credit scoring: money. A key principle of market economies is that accruing money is the just reward for contributing to society. Your bank account is your social credit score - yet we all know that many people get rich without rendering a useful service to society. * Intelligence agencies…

So what are you saying here?

I mean China has money and bank accounts too. Money's not western or capitalist. It has existed for many thousands of years.

Are you saying that this social credit system is not a notable invention, that it doesn't mean anything? This isn't news.

Maybe you're saying that criticism is hypocritical, throwing the first stone from a glass house...?

Hypocrisy is almost always easy to claim, because everything is hypocritical in some sense. ISIS? Who doesn't claim god's on their side. Who doesn't kill people in war? Using chemical weapons? Why does it matter how you kill people. Dictator? Europe's not a perfect democracy either, dont'yaknow.

Ie, unless we have a perfect, consistent system, shut up.

China is a part of the world, a big part. Their great firewall has become a normative thing, and it's affecting the world. Now this. It affects us. We have a right to criticize.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#75

Post by viraptor »

There's an interesting video from Extra Credits about this. It's based on early announcements and repeats some of the popular points, but it addresses the gamification and social pressure side of the issue which I haven't seen discussed that much elsewhere. I recommend watching: https://youtu.be/lHcTKWiZ8sI

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#76

Post by meri_dian »

wu-ikkyu wrote: post #67
meri_dian wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having to be scanned to get on a plane seems like a perfectly reasonable thing to have to do. I fly often and I'm glad the TSA exists and does what it does. I don't feel like my liberty is being taken away in the slightest.

>I'm glad the TSA exists and does what it does. I don't feel like my liberty is being taken away in the slightest. If you truly believe that, would you be opposed to TSA style x-ray machines, genital pat downs, and strip searches any time you were to go to school, work, get on a bus, etc?

Well that would be an inconvenience because I and many others go to work and ride public transport every day. Which is why we don't see TSA checkpoints everywhere; it would be too inconvenient.

People fly infrequently though, and also have a very strong desire to feel safe when flying, so they are for the most part fine with TSA checkpoints. TSA checkpoints are implemented to make people feel safe.

See, it's a balance.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#77

Post by chrischen »

niccccccccc wrote: post #37

> The West has social credit scoring: money ??? as opposed to China which has no money?? China's credit system is paired with dictatorship, censorship, disappearance, and killing. Nowhere near the similarities with West Young Chinese activist missing after sharing plan to wear ‘Xitler’ t-shirt in public https://www.hongkongfp.com/2016/11/03/young-chinese-activist...

China is not a dictatorship. It is a single party representative government system that does not directly elect as many officials as the US does. However even in the US most officials are not directly elected (including the president) and people are still limited to two parties. Consider the last US election, Donald Trump lost the popular direct election, but was still elected by president by the Electoral college (a separate body chosen by the 2 dominant political parties for electing the president).

Guantanamo bay is not run by the Chinese. While they generally do not imprison US citizens, they definitely do not give a shit about human rights for other people.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#78

Post by acct1771 »

faitswulff wrote: post #63
throwafk81 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Police of London actively scan and monitor social networks looking for “hate speech” so they can pursue legal action. What’s the difference between that and what China does?

Shouldn't hate speech should be punished?

Offending someone shouldn't be illegal. Period.

Directly inciting actual physical violence, you might have an argument for.

But words and ideas must remain free to maintain any semblance of a free society.

As other commenters have said: who decides?

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#79

Post by meri_dian »

jackvalentine wrote: post #26
niccccccccc wrote: post #21

There's alot of international people posting on hacker news, and alot of them have anti-US bias. They wish China would be the one that takes over US as the superpower of the world. for those people I have a comment You like posting political views on the internet right? Imagine China is the sole superpower of the world that defeated the democracies of the world. You would be ranked, censored, monitored, caught, jaile…

> They wish China would be the one that takes over US as the superpower of the world. I have literally never seen this.

I see China envy online a lot, especially given our recent political disfunction as people look at the superficial stability of China and want that for their own societies.

Re: China’s experiment in ranking and monitoring citizens has started

#80

Post by acct1771 »

meri_dian wrote: post #76
wu-ikkyu wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm glad the TSA exists and does what it does. I don't feel like my liberty is being taken away in the slightest. If you truly believe that, would you be opposed to TSA style x-ray machines, genital pat downs, and strip searches any time you were to go to school, work, get on a bus, etc?

Well that would be an inconvenience because I and many others go to work and ride public transport every day. Which is why we don't see TSA checkpoints everywhere; it would be too inconvenient. People fly infrequently though, and also have a very strong desire to feel safe when flying, so they are for the most part fine with TSA checkpoints. TSA checkpoints are implemented to make people feel safe. See, it's a balanc…

TSA checkpoints have accelerated to being in subways, etc.

Ratchets only tighten.

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