50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach • Hacker News Board

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#71

Post by Nazare » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:25 PM UTC

urlwolf wrote: post #42

OK, this feels like it will bring about the end. Of something. Facebook? Massive use of data for political campaigns? Anything? If we keep consuming news like this, and do nothing, it's going to scalate massively. Same way as when Snowden told people they were spyed on and they collectively shrugged and continued with their lives as if nothing had happened. We, people in tech, have a massive moral burden to educate '…

The first Ad Sales pitch deck for TheFacebook.com included a slide showing how advertisers can target students based on their sexual orientation, political bend, dating interests, gender, age, education, and social graph. All of which can be used to discriminate based on protected variables, like gender, sexuality, age, mental disability, and race.

This will not be the end, and has been like this from the very beginning. If foreign companies can get access to this information, then intelligence agencies certainly can too.

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#72

Post by r00fus » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:26 PM UTC

ChicagoDave wrote: post #61

olivermarks wrote: post #44

My problem with this 'outing' of CA is that Facebook explicitly commercially exists to harvest user data for Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, Fidelity etc etc so they can profile us. A million dollars is chump change in the crazy US election game. This all seems overly selective - it's ok for some people to profile but not for others. I'm not in favor of any of it to be clear but there is a definite political bia…

I could see a constitutional amendment barring psycho-graphic profiling from election advertising and intent. Not sure how it could be enforced because this is very technical. Even so, there is a significant difference between Coke trying to sell me a flavored soft drink and a firm tweaking my emotions to get me to abstain from voting with false information or to vote against my best interests with false information.…

You do it by making the activity costly. Mandatory opt-out for any persistence of data. Require regular re-enrollments for anyone who opted in.

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#73

Post by auntienomen » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:26 PM UTC

So... If I were in Cambridge Analytica's position, employed to influence the US election, one of the first things I'd do is match this data with any data I could find on voting patterns. Which reminds me, didn't some of the Russian APTs hack into state voter databases?

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#74

Post by IAmEveryone » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:28 PM UTC

616c wrote: post #46

tobilg wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could get access to the full friends‘ user profile data in Graph API earlier than v2.0. If you had 500 friends, and granted friends_* OAuth permissions to an app, the app had access to 501 user profiles.

You know where you read this?

I can confirm this, at least generally. Given access by a user, you had access to all the data the user could access, including the user’s friends’. There may have been exceptions, but, for example, friends’ likes were accessible.

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#75

Post by krapp » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:29 PM UTC

John_KZ wrote: post #64

urlwolf wrote: post #42

OK, this feels like it will bring about the end. Of something. Facebook? Massive use of data for political campaigns? Anything? If we keep consuming news like this, and do nothing, it's going to scalate massively. Same way as when Snowden told people they were spyed on and they collectively shrugged and continued with their lives as if nothing had happened. We, people in tech, have a massive moral burden to educate '…

The problem is that regular people no longer have a place to communicate. It used to be that the workplace, church, neighborhood or union meetings were the place to socialize and discuss these issues and take collective action. Now we have nowhere to turn to. Modern nomadic culture alongside temporary jobs, low trust and personalized news all make sure that we cannot take collective action on anything. We need to fin…

> It used to be that the workplace, church, neighborhood or union meetings were the place to socialize and discuss these issues and take collective action

People still socialize and discuss issues in the real world. Having a Facebook group for a church or neighborhood doesn't preclude anyone from going to church or physically interacting with their neighbors. People also still take collective action in the real world - Antifa, BLM and the Tea Party are three modern examples, but there are countless others which simply don't get media attention.

And, all else aside, social media is still perfectly adequate for enabling communication between most people.

I'm sorry, but your comment seems more rooted in hyperbole than reality.

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#76

Post by UncleEntity » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:31 PM UTC

cryptoz wrote: post #65

UncleEntity wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A foreign power is working with American billionaires to subvert democracy and install a dictator. Seriously? I'm no fan of any politician (or really of "tyranny of the majority") but I was kind of impressed at how well it all worked out last time. An "unpopular" candidate won and the ruling elite turned over the reigns just like they're supposed to do trusting the checks and balances in the system to work. The qui…

That was not a peaceful transition. Trump said in plain language that he would not accept the results if he lost. He called on gun owners to shoot and kill his political opponents who he has also been trying to jail for the past many years. If you are impressed with the level of functional elections and government in the US since the last election, I'm shocked. It is not a functional system. It is clearly disfunction…

> That was not a peaceful transition.

Indeed, it was the only election since I've been alive that the losing side rioted in the streets calling for the overturning of the election results.

> He called on gun owners to shoot and kill his political opponents who he has also been trying to jail for the past many years.

Fake news much?

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#77

Post by dang » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:35 PM UTC

doubt_me wrote: post #62

olivermarks wrote: post #44

My problem with this 'outing' of CA is that Facebook explicitly commercially exists to harvest user data for Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, Fidelity etc etc so they can profile us. A million dollars is chump change in the crazy US election game. This all seems overly selective - it's ok for some people to profile but not for others. I'm not in favor of any of it to be clear but there is a definite political bia…

1. It's not an "outing". 2. Johnson & Johnson doesn't work for Putin. 3. United States elections aren't crazy. Entire parties of Congress being blackmailed into submission by foreign influence is crazy. 4. It's not overly selective. 5. I hope it has an extreme political bias. 6. Facebook commercially exists because the United States has shit privacy laws. 7. How much did Putin pay you to gas light articles? 8. A mill…

> How much did Putin pay you to gas light articles?

That is an egregious violation of the guidelines and a bannable offense on HN. If the rest of the internet is losing its mind, that makes following HN's rules more important, not less.

> Let's not forget about that one time you

This also crosses into personal attack, which is not ok. Heated political arguments are bad enough without users trying to take each other out like this. Please don't do it on HN, regardless of how strongly you disagree.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Edit: your account history unfortunately contains many examples of personal abuse. You've also broken the guideline against using HN primarily for political or ideological battle. We ban accounts that do these things, so would you please re-read the guidelines and use HN as intended from now on?

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#78

Post by jsmthrowaway » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:43 PM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #67

olivermarks wrote: post #44

My problem with this 'outing' of CA is that Facebook explicitly commercially exists to harvest user data for Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, Fidelity etc etc so they can profile us. A million dollars is chump change in the crazy US election game. This all seems overly selective - it's ok for some people to profile but not for others. I'm not in favor of any of it to be clear but there is a definite political bia…

>This all seems overly selective - it's ok for some people to profile but not for others What's the issue here? Selective information distribution is rooted in the society, people are O.K. with some information to be known to some people while kept secret from others due to implication differences. I.E. I'm fine to be profiled for selling me chocolates but I'm not O.K. to be profiled to be manipulated to select publi…

Sadly, the downside of the consumer data culture in which we live is that you don’t really get to make that call. It seems like data is really an all or nothing game at this point, regardless of how society feels about it. Not sure how to change that, either, and I don’t personally think legislation is the answer.

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#79

Post by olivermarks » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:43 PM UTC

eecks wrote: post #59

olivermarks wrote: post #44

My problem with this 'outing' of CA is that Facebook explicitly commercially exists to harvest user data for Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, Fidelity etc etc so they can profile us. A million dollars is chump change in the crazy US election game. This all seems overly selective - it's ok for some people to profile but not for others. I'm not in favor of any of it to be clear but there is a definite political bia…

> Facebook explicitly commercially exists to harvest user data for Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, Fidelity etc etc Sources on this?

https://www.wsj.com/articles/p-g-to-scale-back-targeted-face...

Not hard to find information, although it is typically couched as brand reach and advertising spots. The big data sales side of FB and other sites is more sensitive and less overt

https://www.facebook.com/help/494750870625830?helpref=uf_per...

Re: 50M Facebook profiles harvested for Cambridge Analytica in major data breach

#80

Post by IAmEveryone » Sat, Mar 17, 2018, 5:44 PM UTC

urlwolf wrote: post #42

OK, this feels like it will bring about the end. Of something. Facebook? Massive use of data for political campaigns? Anything? If we keep consuming news like this, and do nothing, it's going to scalate massively. Same way as when Snowden told people they were spyed on and they collectively shrugged and continued with their lives as if nothing had happened. We, people in tech, have a massive moral burden to educate '…

To a certain degree, this is a problem that Facebook has already taken steps against in the last years.

Remember that Facebook gives you zero access to users’ data just for being an advertiser. This scheme relied on users granting access to an app.

Data access by apps was curtailed two or three years ago to no longer include friends’ data. The permissions dialog has also become far more granular. From my observation, apps seem to mostly respect facebook’s rules on data scarcity, i. e. asking only for the data they actually need.

GDPR will enshrine this principle in law at least for European citizen, and it’s somewhat likely that it will have some effect far beyond the borders of Europe.

Regarding elections, first steps will likely align the law with that for TV advertisement. Clear information about an ad’s sponsor should be required, as well as the selectors used to target you. I’ve also heard some chatter about requiring a public repository for all ads. Right now, there might be waves of, for example, racists ads that never get reported in the news because the targeting never hits those people that would consider the ad problematic. The Atlantic is running a pilot program with a chrome extensions that records all advertisement you see on Facebook for such a repository.

In the current political climate, it’s unfortunately unlikely that the US will lead with new regulation. But there are a few decent agencies in the US that can squeeze a lot of mileage out of laws already on the books (the special prosecutor, and even the FEC). Social media companies are also quite scared, both because they fear a hit to their business, and because most of their excecutive do retain some humanity. You can also expect individual European companies to get out the big guns, seeing Trump and other Russia-backed populists rattling the core of the current consensus on liberal, open, civil societies.