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A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

jalopnik.com

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Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>manual mechanism for opening the rear doors from the inside Brother of my close friend literally burned to death in a Hyundai with no manual override for unlocking/opening doors. Granted he had modified the car's stereo system with custom speakers and the roadside mechanic did not do a good job with it which caused short circuit/fire. But had he been able to manually open the doors he would still be alive today. And…

That's horrible. I have an enduring fear due to the lack of manual window winders. Harder to open a door in water than wind down a window. Related - a woman was stuck in her Audi Q3 in 41C (106F) heat. (Australia, 2003)

Yeah window winders too - they should have a knob that drops the window down someplace not accidentally accessible. That should be easy enough to do without adding any significant bulk.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#72
post #55
post #9

A fun comparison: Munro on the BMW i3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqiBWfsDTAA Munro on the Tesla Model 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCIo8e12sBM

That was a very informative video. My respect for the CEO shot up quickly. He wasn't really trying to sell anything but simply illustrating points of concern. I can tell he very much enjoys doing what he does.

I know this is a place for software/web developers but good god, really? It was at best a minor tech article in a car magazine in the Wal-Mart magazine stands.

What exactly did you learn?

He kept saying the i3 "life module" (agile! AGILE!) was some magical achievement. Yeah, carbon fiber is neat. They also choose the grain direction of panels for optimum efficiency.

- We've been using grain direction on wood for what, thousands of years?

- We've been made cars "strong" for century. It's called a tube frame. And it's one of the main reasons dragsters/NASCAR drivers don't die on impacts that will kill most people in consumer cars.

What's actually important these days is not how "strong" a frame is. It's how it deforms to absorb maximum energy on impact so the passengers experience the least acceleration possible. "Strong" has been solved. And crush areas have been common for decades upon decades. The only new thing here is they're using carbon fiber. And the only reason they're doing that... is 1) "marketing" and 2) weight reduction because battery cars are very heavy AND very sensitive to weight for mileage.

Automotive companies aren't on the frontline of technology. They're on the frontline of CHEAP/mass-producible technology.

Simply putting some carbon fiber on a body is not magical to us practicing mechanical engineers. But I guess it may seem like "magic" to software people, the way mechanical people see IT/software as magic.

What's actually "Cool" about this company/video is how they can tear down entire vehicles and come up with accurate cost estimates, as well as the construction order. That takes a _lot_ of work and industry experience. But the technology in those cars? It's not even remotely new.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#73
It's very interesting to look at the number and complexity of parts in even an extremely old and thus much simpler car, then contrast it to cars today with at least 2 orders of magnitude more; this one for 1929-32 Chevrolets, for example, is already over 300 pages:

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/parts/1929_32/index.htm...

...and from it we can also glean somewhat surprising historical facts, such as the fact that pistons were $1.75 each: http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/parts/1929_32/2932mppl0...

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#74
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manufacturing is a large industry, but it's what China was targeting in the 1950s. They're aiming higher now. Most of the tech transfer is around next gen industries, such as batteries. And as for who is forcing foreign companies to do this? Hilariously enough, capitalism. Multinationals can't afford to miss selling to the Chinese market, or their board / shareholder's vote them out. So they're left to strike the bes…

I must disagree. India is a big market too. Then why didn't the multinationals come to share technology and set up manufacturing in India? I think it's got more to do with having decade long focus under a single leadership than have politicians floundering to get reelected every 5 years.

> Then why didn't the multinationals come to share technology and set up manufacturing in India?

Because the indian government didn't demand it as a condition of entry like the chinese government did.

Have you never wondered why western companies have to engage in 50/50 ventures with chinese companies into china instead of just entering china like they do every other country?

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#75
post #9

A fun comparison: Munro on the BMW i3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqiBWfsDTAA Munro on the Tesla Model 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCIo8e12sBM

That's laughably bad of Tesla - the thumb wide gaps in the body, the gluing rubber parts on glass seals because the original one was way out of tolerance, door rattle, one door having two ways to open but not the others - the screen that goes you have activated alternate door opening mechanism or some such thing - all pretty embarrassing. Never mind the insane difficulty to open the hood in an accident which looks li…

Porsche had (or has) similar issues with opening the hood without power.

https://perryandcoblog.com/2009/11/17/porsche-carrera-911-99...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ss6-8TJYIqE

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#76
post #9

A fun comparison: Munro on the BMW i3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqiBWfsDTAA Munro on the Tesla Model 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCIo8e12sBM

From the title I was hoping they'd actually, well, "tear into" the Model 3. Instead I got seven minutes of them complaining about the door handles. They did raise a couple of legitimate concerns (dual ways to open the doors, no manual/mechanical way to open the rear doors, body fit and finish seemed poor) but it was hard to pick them out from all the "hurr durr never seen that before" and associated whinging about things that were probably on page one of the user manual.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#77

Ironic that is perfectly okay by manufacturers for someone to disassemble their car yet electronics companies go nuts and sue you. https://spectrum.ieee.org/green-tech/conservation/why-we-mus...

Car companies use third parties to decap and analyse chips before negotiating the buying price. Source: I was the one buying the IT app to manage the results of the analysis.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#78
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That should've been obvious. To be fair, from what I understand the no fly zone restrictions thing actually does require geolocation lookup and I think those no fly zones can change, so pinging a server and checking in makes sense. From just a pure telemetry perspective, knowing where people are flying the drones at is useful for product development and marketing. (In response, DJI did release a privacy mode that doe…

> To be fair, from what I understand the no fly zone restrictions thing actually does require geolocation lookup and I think those no fly zones can change, so pinging a server and checking in makes sense. Not exactly. Issue a map file with the no-fly zones as shapes (as easy as possible to save on space) and embed it with a creation timestamp. Force an update every 30 days - have the app download the file and upload…

No Fly zones are updated much more often than that, and furthermore nobody would be surprised with a US companies product phoning home.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen similar comments everywhere I stumbled across this story. It's an easy takeaway, but that's not how automakers look at competitive benchmarking. Working with a company like Munro is an engineering decision. Munro breaks cars down, reverse engineers everything they possibly can, and draws as many conclusions about production methods as possible. Engineers with other automakers use this data to learn from how…

Maybe he's trying to sell his services to Tesla so he dialed up the prickiness. "I'm calling this out about your car. You got quality problems. We can help."

I don't think Munro is in that business. Understanding how something is built is different from how to consistently and price effectively build it to specs/tolerances.

Re: A Company That Tears Cars Apart to Find Out How They're Built

#80
post #76
post #9

A fun comparison: Munro on the BMW i3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqiBWfsDTAA Munro on the Tesla Model 3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCIo8e12sBM

From the title I was hoping they'd actually, well, "tear into" the Model 3. Instead I got seven minutes of them complaining about the door handles. They did raise a couple of legitimate concerns (dual ways to open the doors, no manual/mechanical way to open the rear doors, body fit and finish seemed poor) but it was hard to pick them out from all the "hurr durr never seen that before" and associated whinging about th…

I don't think "hurr durr never seen that before" is an accurate paraphrase; I'd say it was more along the lines of "I've never seen bodywork this shoddy on a modern luxury vehicle."
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